Sustain in flamenco guitars

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Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

Sustain in flamenco guitars

I read this in the old versus new thread (page 5) about the amount of sustain in a flamenco guitar: (Quote, Tom Blackshear)

QUOTE "don't worry about the sustain, it is longer but well with-in the range of good flamenco technique. 22 to 28 counts is about right for that style and sustain; count to moderate soleares tempo. " QUOTE.

I would like an explanation of that. I´ve never heard of this kind of meassuring before.
Moderate soleá is around 90 bpm. so 22 - 28 counts is 15 - 18 seconds. Is it the way I should understand it?
What are we meassuring? a tap tone, a tone or a chord? Anyways, 15 - 18 seconds is very long IMO.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 25 2011 8:57:44

Anders Eliasson

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Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Bum

I´m still interested in this. Any comments.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 8:44:44

Andy Culpepper

Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

I'm curious too

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 15:14:22

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

If 1 beat = 1 count
then 90 bpm would equal 1.5 beats/counts per second which would give 33-42 seconds.

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Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 15:21:25

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Deniz, I´m not a master in mathematics, but I think you get it the wrong way around. 90bpm make every beat 60seconds diveded by 90 = 0,6666666666.

Anyways, what I find to be interesting is more than anything what it is that last these 22 - 28 counts........... a chord, a tone, a hum in the soundhole at the guitars own frequenzy? whatever.
As it was expressed its just luthier insider blah - blah without any meaning.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 18:37:52

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Well i also thought it was an worth asking remark. Lets see if Tom answers...
Anyway... btw you need to see it as a fraction: 90 beats over 60 seconds. That makes MORE than 1 beat per second. Precisely 9 over 6 beats, or 3 over 2 beats which is 1.5
120 bpm makes exactly 2 beats per second, not 0.5 for example.

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Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 19:30:02

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

exactly. But since its 1,5 beats per second, then you´ll have to divide the counts with 1,5 instead of multiply with it. (or multiply with 0,66 which is the same just the other way round) If not the counts will be way to long.
Just look at your first post. On a 90bpm, you got 33 seconds out of 22 counts. (22 x 1,5) This means that 90 counts would end up being 135 seconds. (90 bpm is 90 beats per minut)

Nice little brain fresher after this New versus old farting.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 19:51:24

jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to XXX)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deniz

Well i also thought it was an worth asking remark. Lets see if Tom answers...
Anyway... btw you need to see it as a fraction: 90 beats over 60 seconds. That makes MORE than 1 beat per second. Precisely 9 over 6 beats, or 3 over 2 beats which is 1.5
120 bpm makes exactly 2 beats per second, not 0.5 for example.

Anders is correct. Instead of 90 beats over 60 seconds it should be 90 beats over 22 - 28 beats or roughly 1/4 to 1/3 of a minute.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 19:51:36

Sean

Posts: 672
Joined: Jan. 20 2011
From: Canada

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Yes what is an acceptable amount before sounding to classical and what is an optimal range. Just looking for opinions, players and luthiers pipe up I'm interested in knowing how much everyones opinion may vary.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 20:06:29

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

oooops

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Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 20:10:36

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Sustain in flamenco guitars (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

quote:

Yes what is an acceptable amount before sounding to classical and what is an optimal range. Just looking for opinions, players and luthiers pipe up I'm interested in knowing how much everyones opinion may vary.

The problem is that we have no idea what this is all about.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 29 2011 20:28:35