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The Very Worst of the Mundo y Formas de Flamenco?
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Ron.M
Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland
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 The Very Worst of the Mundo y Formas...
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OK.
Everybody loves Bulerías and Tangos.
Everybody does.... including all the Flamencos I hear on Ondajerez.
Solea por Bulerias, Fandangos and Alegrias....
Occasionaly Soleares and (seldom) Siguiriyas....
Guajiras and Zapateado have been rediscovered by a few notables including Emilio Maya.
But what are the styles you hate most?
On my own hate list , and have been for a while now... are:-
Farruca.....
The sheer Joy of any Flamenco student playing to a bunch of Culture Vultures!
Not actually Flamenco, but from the North of Spain and "Flamencoised".
Utterly predictable and boring.
Probably the best recordings of all time?
Sabicas and Paco de Lucia IMO.
Nothing since.
Zambra, (The Moorish Dance). (God help us!)
The most utterly boring thing that Flamenco has ever embraced.
Apart from the opening few bars of Moorish style open tuning and dissonance, there is nowhere else to go except playing those same monotonous chords over and over, such that if you had a gun, you'd happily shoot the guitarist. LOL!
Sabicas did a really good Zambra in a recording from the 50's.
He kept it short, with some nice key changes, but required overdubbing at the studio to make it work.
The only Zambra that's ever been any good IMO.
The next candidate for the bullet are the Tarantas merchants!
The opening chords.... great!
"Hey this is going to be some serious stuff".
Unfortunately most often turns out to be a serious yawn....
(Christ, can this guy finish so I can get out for a smoke LOL!)
At one time I wasn't into Sevillanas, but now I'm beginning to see the light.
Again it's not "Flamenco", but "Flamencoized" Andalucian Folk Music.
But it is very "Flamenco" sounding, and from the Saura film has many facets and possibilities.
So I have a very open, if not positive mind to this style.
Does anybody else have Pet Hates in Flamenco?
I'm talking mainly about Solo stuff here.
cheers
Ron
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Date Nov. 18 2004 20:43:29
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Miguel de Maria
Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ
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RE: The Very Worst of the Mundo y Fo... (in reply to Ron.M)
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Yes, Ron, Carmen Amaya was famous for her Zambras, if I recall, but I have never heard it.
As far as my Peores del Mundo Flamenquito, I have to say that Farruca is a monotonous, horrible thing.... why knows why they even bothered importing it into flamenco. Solo guitarists doing boring tarantas is a horrible thing--learn alegrias first, joker! And have you ever heard Tanguillos? There is a terror that really shows all the worst elements of folk music. I hate how they always end the Alegrias nowadays on that weak, tepid E9 chord. Ug, please not the E9 chord. And I hate guitarists who never play a fast scale on their albums. Not even one... You have to do at least one to show that you can.
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Date Nov. 18 2004 21:29:58
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musicalgrant
Posts: 188
Joined: Oct. 21 2004
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RE: The Very Worst of the Mundo y Fo... (in reply to Ron.M)
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Well pets hates, I used to dislike Zapateado, rumba, tanguillos, and Farucca, tilL I played at a wedding and a simle tanguillos went down a treat, lol. And the Rumba went even better, especially as there was a Spanish family there, who started doing the palmas and then we were off  LOL
But I have heard a Zapateado played to a musicaly educated audience to a standing ovation, and on other occasions just a bit of polite appluase...I think I dont really have any hates towards any of the styles of falmenco. But I'll let you know if I find any.
I think like the Farruca if the audience and the performer and dancer are in the mood then it can take off and create a storm, but it all depends on the context etc...
I dont have any hates as yet..
Hey Ron that flamenco master thing you made is brilliant, I've been working with it on a Soleares and it gives it so much more, it fills all the gaps and gives one so much room to play around with..
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Date Nov. 19 2004 0:26:37
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Miguel de Maria
Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ
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RE: The Very Worst of the Mundo y Fo... (in reply to Guest)
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I think we were talking about what we hated, not what we liked. Let me add to my list of what I don't like...people who take every opportunity to take shots at guitarists and remind them that "in Spain, the guitarist is nothing, the cante is everything, then the dance, then the sherry, then the person who plays the top of the barrel, then, finally the guitarist." My perspective, living in America, is--yes, we get it... flamenco is about the cante.
Another thing that gets on my nerves is some people who seem to take a shot at Vicente Amigo about every time they can. I feel Vicente Amigo has paid his dues in the flamenco community and music scene and should be allowed to play whatever he wants without being gratuitiously criticized.
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Date Nov. 19 2004 13:44:45
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Jim Opfer
Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.
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RE: The Very Worst of the Mundo y Fo... (in reply to Ron.M)
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Yea!
After 30 minutes of jumping around and slapping feet frantically to Farruca, Taranta, Zambra or Sevillianas there's a big finish, lots of exertion, huge applause, dancer exillerated, huge smile, bursting with sweat, eyes shut soaking up the air, takes a bow and farts in your face.
Phew!! has to be the worst. 
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Date Nov. 19 2004 17:02:30
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musicalgrant
Posts: 188
Joined: Oct. 21 2004
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RE: The Very Worst of the Mundo y Fo... (in reply to Ron.M)
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I can't believe you people are giving the flamenco guitarist so much flack  Give us a chance  LOL...
I remember on one occasion being in a village pub that had an acoutice evening, with loads of people playing folk music and stuff, and the pub audience chatted all through it, and then I played a simple Granainas melody (you ca hear it on my we page) and they all went silent!!! So they liked the solo flamenco guitar.
I dont think there is anything as sublime as the solo guitar, it has an amazing sound, a personal sound, that is not found on any other instrument, like keyboard for instance, or the violin, with the guitar, the guitarist touches the strings with both hands giving it that personal touch and sound, what other instrument does this apart from the voice?
The fact that there are many new guitarists struggling to play flamenco, and sound not so good, surley we should encourage them as they may one day be the new paco's, or Juan de parsnips!!
I know that flamenco guitar without the palmas, singer, dancer is incomplete, but hey! we are all doing our best with what little resources we have. I would love to have palmas whilst doing a solo gig, but find anyone who can do it is aproblem over here in the uk..
The Palmas with solo guitar are brilliant like Tomatito and PDL, and they give it an extra dimension which is missing without it..
And helps the soloist to know where the compas is, Yep they too rely on visual or aural cues to know where the ten is, and we try and do it without!!?? LOL
Anyhow I love flamenco guitar by itself, it is pure and raw, and can not hide behind a singer dancer or palmas.
Cheers Grant 
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Date Nov. 22 2004 23:36:15
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