Nervous fingers...

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Nervous fingers...

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aeolus

Posts: 765
Joined: Oct. 30 2009
From: Mier

Nervous fingers...

...is how Andres Segovia characterized the "new breed" ie non traditional flamenco players. I have just found Jeronimo Maya on YouTube and he was a prodigy and has nervous fingers for sure. No doubt gypsy jazz will disturb some, but I liked it but wonder about a whole album of it. Interesting is the extensive use of the highest register for extended periods.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 2:30:06

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Jeronimo's great. "Nervous fingers"? It seems to me like the older players' technique wasn't as clean, giving more of a "nervous" impression. Oh well...

Leo de Aurora is a great flamenco player too who was unfortunately a bit forgotten in his brother's shadow:

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 2:52:18

KMMI77

Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

I had some classes with jeronimo at el mundo flamenco in london. He actually described his picado action as nervous. He was an interesting character.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:34:21

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to KMMI77)

I think Jeronimo is phenomenal (as well as being pretty gorgeous

) You did a workshop with him in London a year or so ago didn't you John?

Kris I didn't know he had taught at El Mundo.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:37:47

KMMI77

Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Woops! that photo is massive. http://www.foroflamenco.com/micons/m9.gif

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:38:07

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to KMMI77)

Kris I would love to see that pic but it's so big I have to scroll to see it all! Do you have any way of reducing the size and then re-post it?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:39:23

aeolus

Posts: 765
Joined: Oct. 30 2009
From: Mier

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to John O.)

quote:

"Nervous fingers"? It seems to me like the older players' technique wasn't as clean, giving more of a "nervous" impression. Oh well...

Segovia was given to speaking in flowery metaphor and can't be taken literally here otherwise I would certainly qualify when playing to an audience.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:43:19

KMMI77

Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

It must have been about 8 years ago. There were about 6 of us. He spent the whole day teaching us. We all played something for him one by one and he commented on everyone, offering any advice he felt would help. It was great to watch and listen to the energy he played with in such a small room.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:43:53

KMMI77

Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

This should be smaller. Lol!

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Attachment (1)

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:49:24

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

quote:

I would certainly qualify when playing to an audience.

Yeah me too. A guitar teacher I know has a blob of vaseline on the top of his guitar on a performance, which he dips into if he feels his fingertips are getting dry. No way I would need that! My fingers slip off the strings no problem!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 3:56:38

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to KMMI77)

Yeah I did a workshop with him a couple of years ago. It was great!

I always have to comment on some of the things Segovia had to say. He did a lot for the guitar, but was in some aspects a closed-minded grump

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 4:01:52

KMMI77

Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

javascript:void(AddText('

'))

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 4:06:00

aeolus

Posts: 765
Joined: Oct. 30 2009
From: Mier

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to KMMI77)

quote:

javascript:void(AddText(' '))

Yeah, I know just what you mean Kris.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 28 2009 4:44:08

michel

Posts: 315
Joined: Apr. 14 2008
From: france

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

thank you for sharing aeolus, i didn't know Jeronimo Maya up to now - what a great player! (both are fantastic)
never saw someone playing gipsy jazz stuff on a flamenco guitar, i'm going ballistic

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 2:21:03

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

[Deleted]

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Nov. 29 2009 11:00:24

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 10:59:53

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

I couldn't resist...

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Attachment (1)

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 11:02:56

amigo

Posts: 276
Joined: Nov. 1 2008
From: Greece

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Two fantastic player together!! (grisha..jeronimo!!!)
Grisha...waiting for a new upload video..!!!

John is there any video from the workshops with Jeronimo in london???It would be perfect !!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 11:51:30

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to Grisha)

Grisha, what were you guys thinking there?
"Your picado is not faster than mine"
- "wanna make a bet?"
"Sure!"

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:00:36

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Jejeje! (Spanish laughter) No, here we already played for each other, so he knew I had a decent picado, and I knew he was a great player. Taken in 1994.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:07:40

amigo

Posts: 276
Joined: Nov. 1 2008
From: Greece

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Grisha if you like ...will you share with us a new video from a recent concert??
I think everybody wants it in here for sure!!!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:24:08

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Well, amigo, I have tons of videos, but I am not satisfied with my playing. Sounds too heavy for my taste right now, and plus, I got tired of being attacked for not playing my own music. So, I don't practice that stuff anymore, and I don't practice technique. I am trying to compose, and it's a painful experience. But I am not giving up. You know, when Todd switched to playing with fingers, he must have felt this way too. Except, my decision is more legit, imho.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:35:15

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Grisha I remember you uploaded a short mp3 of some alegrias falsetas you composed ad hoc. It was fabulous... It would be strange if you would have problems composing nice things.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:40:59

bursche

Posts: 1182
Joined: Jul. 19 2007
From: Frankfurt, Germany

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to Grisha)

quote:

I am trying to compose, and it's a painful experience.

Indeed. You throw away about 90 % of your ideas.
And you always want to surprise everyone, even yourself, which can be exhausting.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:48:16

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Okay, don't want to hijack the topic, but I have a problem composing. See, I come up with ideas, develop them, and then suddenly remember that Paco, Vicente or someone else already used that, and the connection is recognizable. I feel cornered, no room to breath, because I do not want to plagiarize. And then I question why what I compose sounds the way I composed it, and what do I want to say with it, etc. I am always afraid it's not logical enough, that the phrasing is off, that harmonies are not cool enough and don't flow smoothly, that rhythm is too straightforward and repetitive, etc, etc, etc...

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 12:56:35

bursche

Posts: 1182
Joined: Jul. 19 2007
From: Frankfurt, Germany

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to Grisha)

I'm afraid I'm hijacking the topic now...

Of course people will expect more from you than from me, as I am totally unknown - You are a professional and by far better than me.
And being content with one's work surely is the most dangerous attitude an artist can develop.

Finally you won't publish anything until you feel at least bit of satisfaction, though.
I think this is my advantage. People expect nothing so I'm free to ask for their opinion whenever I like.

Nevertheless I'm very curious about how your work would sound. I know it would be exciting for me.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 13:36:17

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Fine, you win. I will upload something on youtube, something I did today.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 14:39:51

amigo

Posts: 276
Joined: Nov. 1 2008
From: Greece

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

bravo Grisha!!!!
We wait for the surprise!!!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 14:49:35

KMMI77

Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to aeolus)

Love the photo Grisha!

I have a few dodgy photo's with guitarists but i will save them for another time. I approached vicente when he was sitting in his car outside a bank in cordoba once. I think he thought i was a real nut.I didn't have a camera at the time but it would have made a nice photo. Him sitting in his car and me leaning in his window

He was wearing a white silk outfit. I thought he looked pretty funny, Lol!

Grisha, I try to approach composition with a " I am going to play whatever i like attitude " Trust your own instincts. Whenever i try to write something to satisfy other peoples expectations i feel the same way you do. Nobody manages to write music that pleases everyone. If people are comparing you to the greats then that is a compliment. You take guitar technique to an amazing level and i would feel privileged to hear any of your ideas. If they sound like the style of Paco's early music, there is nothing wrong with that.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 29 2009 22:02:03

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to KMMI77)

I remember asking Jason this same question about composing and he said it just takes practice and to stick with it, also to listen to other music besides flamenco for inspiration.

I wouldn't worry about ideas sounding similar to what's been done before. You can hear so many of Sabicas licks in Paco de Lucias old compositions, just like you hear Pacos ideas in...ehhh...just about everyone's compositions who came after him.

Your technique should give you the freedom to do just about anything you want and with all the pieces I've seen you play you must have a huge library full of ideas to play with. I'm looking forward to hearing it!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 30 2009 8:26:25

mark indigo

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007

RE: Nervous fingers... (in reply to Grisha)

quote:

I come up with ideas, develop them, and then suddenly remember that Paco, Vicente or someone else already used that, and the connection is recognizable.

i dream of being that good....

if i was in that situation right now i would compose an album/repertoire of "derivative" stuff and then move on, i honestly think that is how a lot of great artists have developed themselves, especially in any kind of traditional thing like flamenco, absorb the influences and then move beyond them - and besides if it is too new and original maybe noone will recognize it as flamenco