rasgueado

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

rasgueado

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>General >>

Page: [1]

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

koella

Posts: 2194
Joined: Sep. 10 2005
From: holland

rasgueado

Hi

I have a question about rasgueado. Which ones are necessary to learn. I know the amii,aii, xamii and pmp (abanico I believe ?). Can I do everything with these. Or are there more that are absolutely necessary to learn ?

Thanks.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 28 2006 20:00:39

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

i would add P a i to the list.

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 28 2006 20:35:29

koella

Posts: 2194
Joined: Sep. 10 2005
From: holland

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

Ok thanx Henrik. I saw you and Ricardo use it. But what's the benefit of pai when you use pmp already ?

Ps what happened to Florian ? Is he on holiday or something ? I miss his posts don't you ?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 1 2006 9:58:56

Ricardo

Posts: 14884
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

Benefit for me with Pai is it can use less wrist movement, be more controlled and softer volume even at high speed. I can't do pmp or p am p triplet stroke really fast and soft at the same time. So using it (pai) for a slow or medium Verdiales beat is essential for me.

Also, the loudest heaviest strum I can do is just up and down with the hand, fingers down, thumb up, with the wrist or arm moving. Like you are strumming pick style. So work on as many different rasgueados you hear about, and make up your own mind which you like, and when to apply them. Techniques are a means to an end. Rasgueado's are a rhythmic strumming technique, so the purpose of each is what the rhythm calls for.

I hear Tom Whiteley has like over a hundered rasg. on his site. check it out.

Ricardo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 1 2006 10:13:57

El Becko

Posts: 49
Joined: Nov. 23 2005
From: Paris

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

quote:

I know the amii,aii, xamii and pmp (abanico I believe ?)

These are basically the ones I use. Actually I use 2 others : the triplet iia you can find in tangos or fandangos... and there is another one I like a lot : a 4-stroke played x a+m i i. I took a few lessons with a guy who showed it to me as an introduction to the 5-stroke xamii. However I have no idea if this is a standard one or just an exercise... Anyway I keep on using it as I like its very percusive sound.

But I am certainly not a reference... actually I look forward to reading the more advanced players and what they think would be the "rasgueado survival kit".

By the way, I have just seen in the Juan Martin Solo book an 8-note rasgueado : xamixami, all downstroke. It think it is a little weird as I feel the i upstroke is missing...

I am wondering if this is because of this one that I was told to practice the xamii rasgueado with the xam going back DURING the i downstroke. I do not know wether one should invest some time on it...

Cheers...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 1 2006 10:20:24

Jon Boyes

Posts: 1377
Joined: Jul. 10 2003

RE: rasgueado (in reply to El Becko)

quote:

ORIGINAL: El Becko
By the way, I have just seen in the Juan Martin Solo book an 8-note rasgueado : xamixami, all downstroke. It think it is a little weird as I feel the i upstroke is missing...

Its just the standard C-A-M-I four stroke, repeated. Many old school players play their continuous ras like this. Tricky to do as C has to be returning whilst I is playing, its a kind of rolling motion.

_____________________________

Spanish Guitarist in Devon, Cornwall and Somerset

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 1 2006 10:26:54

koella

Posts: 2194
Joined: Sep. 10 2005
From: holland

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

Thanx guys !

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 1 2006 17:18:54

fevictor

Posts: 377
Joined: Nov. 22 2005
From: Quepos / Manuel Antonio, Costa Rica

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

El Becko, did you see that rasgeado in the solea por bulerias section? If you have made it that far, let me know!! I have a compas question at that exact spot!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 2 2006 16:54:59

El Becko

Posts: 49
Joined: Nov. 23 2005
From: Paris

RE: rasgueado (in reply to fevictor)

Hello Victor,

Yes this is in the solea por buleria section. However, I haven't practised this particular piece yet. I just read the part a few days ago as I am looking for a new piece to study and I am hesitating between this one and a few others. I'll see this week end which one it is going to be...

But you should go ahead with your question anyway...

Cheers

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 3 2006 10:54:13

fevictor

Posts: 377
Joined: Nov. 22 2005
From: Quepos / Manuel Antonio, Costa Rica

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

My question is this:

After the first line of down stroke A chords, he goes into the rasgueados. How do you count the beats in this first section!!? The problem is that ol' Juan likes to play a little too fast for me to properly clap it out. The first beat is the little finger starting the first rasgueado, but it seems that the two rasgueados and the first index stroke make up one beat, and the second index stroke is the start of the second beat. Does this make sense?

I find that I can't learn the piece unless I can properly tap my foot to it. I wish that they would've included counts showing where the accents are.

Can you help me?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 3 2006 11:32:04

El Becko

Posts: 49
Joined: Nov. 23 2005
From: Paris

RE: rasgueado (in reply to fevictor)

Hi Victor,

I am like you: I need to be able to tap my foot to be able to play something with the fingers!

I do not have the tab with me right now, but I will have a look at it this week-end. I hope I will be able to help you there.

Un saludo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 3 2006 12:55:00

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

I like paipai. A great invention of nature!!! hehe.. (insider joke)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 3 2006 13:11:57

El Becko

Posts: 49
Joined: Nov. 23 2005
From: Paris

RE: rasgueado (in reply to fevictor)

Hi Victor,

I had a closer look at the JM solea por buleria. I guess your question is about bar 5 (and bars 9 and 13 where we have the same pattern). Here is my understanding...

Fisrt, if you have a look at bar 17, Juan plays a very standard strumming pattern on a Bb chord on the beat 1, 2 and 3 of the 12 beat solea compas. It goes:

Beat 1: e a m i i
e a m are all donwstrokes and the ii are down then upstroke.
You may want to tap on your foot on the beat: e stroke.

Beat 2: e a m i i
e a m are all donwstrokes and the ii are down then upstroke.
You may want to tap on your foot on the beat: e stroke.

Beat 3: i i
ii are down then upstroke.
You may want to tap on your foot on the beat: i downstroke with a golpe.

In the bar 5, the pattern is different. This a kind of a nice variation around the standard compas. Juan does not put the accent on beat 3 like it should be in the compas (accents on 3 6 8 10 12), but after it when your foot is up (do we say "on the counter beat" in English?).

To do that, Juan plays the two last i strokes with downstrokes only. The second one is accentuated or even with a golpe (bar 9).

So it goes:

Beat 1: e a m i i
e a m are all donwstrokes and the ii are down then upstroke.
You may want to tap on your foot on the beat: e stroke.

Beat 2: e a m i i
e a m are all donwstrokes and the ii are down then upstroke.
You may want to tap on your foot on the beat: e stroke.

Beat 3: i i
ii are both down strokes.
You may want to tap on your foot on the beat: first i downstroke. The second i downstroke is played stronger when the foot is up.

I hope this is clearer now. If not, let me know, I can play it slowly and upload a video.

Cheers,
Philippe

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 5 2006 11:39:10

fevictor

Posts: 377
Joined: Nov. 22 2005
From: Quepos / Manuel Antonio, Costa Rica

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

Phillipe,

WOW! Thanks for the breakdown! I´ve printed off what you wrote and I´ll put it to the test when I get home tonight. The problem is that my neighbor always complains when I play afetr 10 pm, so i normally practise tremolo at night. But you have a real talent when it comes to explaining the compas. I´ll let you know tommorow how I did.

PS. This is why i love this forum!

Vic

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 5 2006 19:29:53

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: rasgueado (in reply to fevictor)

Victor,
usa espuma, amigo. Se pone entre las cuerdas y la tapa. Lo siento para mi espanol mal, pero quiero practicar.

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 6 2006 13:09:14

fevictor

Posts: 377
Joined: Nov. 22 2005
From: Quepos / Manuel Antonio, Costa Rica

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

Mi estimado Miguel,

Me imagino que me estas comentando acerca de que no puedo tocar guitarra despues de las 10 pm, verdad? Y que me aconsejas usar "stirofoam" para que no suene la guitarra? Si es el caso, gracias...lo intentare. Otherwise your spanish seems to be quite good! Keep practising mi viejo.

Saludos

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 6 2006 21:34:30

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: rasgueado (in reply to koella)

I think he means esponja, i.e. a sponge.

Styrofoam seems wrong to me.

Maybe someone should ask Yamaha to make a silent flamenco guitar. I imagine that the biggest problem with the silent classical is that there's nowhere to tap...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 14 2006 4:34:43