what for a importance has flamecno today in spain

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what for a importance has flamecno ...

What for a importance has flamenco today in spain!?
Please help me I have to make a work about that!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 5 2005 19:46:09

sorin popovici

Posts: 427
Joined: Jan. 7 2005
From: Iasi, Romania

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to Guest)

Hmm ....well,I dont know what you mean,your english is not very good.

I guess you mean "How important is flamenco in Spain now ? ".
I'm asking myself the same question ...if it is a mass phenomenon or not.
I know a guy who met a classical guitarist from Spain while the guitarist was
paying a visit to a music school in Romania.And he (the guitarist from Spain)
was asked to play a little flamenco .He responded : "I am not a gypsy.I dont play
gypsy music".

Now ,when I heared this story ...I understood that Spain is not all about flamenco
as I thought(though in my mind it was )
...and probably a spaniard when he is talking about the traditional
music of Spain ,he doesnt mean flamenco.So flamenco is not synonimous with
traditional music of Spain.From what I know, I tend to believe that flamenco
though probably it is more and more popular, flamenco is still the music
of some comunities but not the music that entire Spain embrace and call it their own.

I'm really curious if I'm right ,never asked someone from Spain (though through
this forum I have this posibilty) how things really are.

Ok,if you still dont get any response .Go to www.wikipedia.com and type
in the search "flamenco" and happy copy-paste

One day ,I hope to get there ...and I will put this question then,
but now it's not the moment .

<just had to get thist out >
I sadly hear that romanians are not very welcomed
there(it is true that Spain doesnt get the most representative romanians, and
from this point of view I understand their adverse reaction(they are good people
and low quality people in any country)....but still that incident
with that melody composed by some DJ about romanian workers, it's too much ..... ).
</end>

VLPS(very long post scriptum):

If u read this and dont understand what melody I'm talking about ,skip
this post...it's really not that important,I just had to say it.
If u really want to know what is all about ,read it here

http://www.elmundo.es/cronica/2005/495/1113084008.html

I couldnt find a newspaper that still has the news as I've heared it in 2004,
,but some of the story is here.I also listened to the mp3,
and I'm to say the least upset.I dont know if this was
a big story in Spain ,but in Romania it was ...and now imagine
me explaining to some romanian rednecks that not all spaniards
are bad.This should have been stopped at that time,we are
not living in the fifties, racism and xenophobia is not some
"new" phenomenon that they just cant control.

I know I wont be shoping for a Conde in the next six or seven years
,cause they are damn expensive but I wouldnt want to have to buy it from
internet cause Madrid is dangerous.

quote:
"Y, más grave aún, hasta hace unos días sonaban a todo volumen en algunas discotecas de Levante y Madrid. Imagínense cientos de chavales dando saltos en el centro de una pista de baile, con el cubata en una mano coreando los estribillos de esas canciones:
..........."
/quote
(the lyrics are all over the web,the link from above is in spanish and has some of the lyrics.)

Anyway...what was this thread about ?
I promise I'll try to think happy thoughts more often...people tend to say that
I exagerate(and I tend to disagree

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 6 2005 3:15:11

henrym3483

Posts: 1584
Joined: Nov. 13 2005
From: Limerick,Ireland

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to sorin popovici)

sorin,

i can kinda relate to that, once when i had a conversation with a spaniard at my university, i told him of my love for flamenco guitar and the music as a whole, and he told me to my face i would never understand it because i did come from andalousia, nor was i a gitano, to add further salt to the would he said to me

"no tienes el duende ni el gracia en su sangre." (you have neither the ability or spirit in your blood)

this really pissed me off, i said can you play guitar and he said no, i said can you do cante and he said no, i said have you ever practiced any form of flamenco. no oncemore

to which i replied [insults deleted by Admin]

this shut him up, later that week i played a little for the other spanish student at a house party and all were enthralled that a foreinger should be interested in such an obscur part of their culture.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 6 2005 11:41:56

Kate

Posts: 1827
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: Living in Granada, Andalucía

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to Guest)

Hello guest, I have a feeling you also posted this request some time back on the flamenco dancer forum. In which case you have already got a lot of answers and I may just be repeating myself. If that was not you then it seems like this is a popular topic for some reason. I assume you are studying Spanish LatinAmerican Studies or perhaps it is just for a general essay. The first thing to realise is that Spain is a large country with many cultures, the Basques, Gallegos, Catalans have nothing to do with flamenco which is part of Andalucian culture and then only a small part. Flamenco has been an important part of the tourist industry and often is used to represent Spain but this is far from the truth and can cause many Spanish people to be offended. A friend of mine gets very annoyed to be stereotyped as dancing, dark haired exotic creature with a rose between her teeth. I suspect it would also be impossible to calculate how big or small a part flamenco plays in the overall economics of the country as revenue from flamenco comes from so many different sources, including the tourist industry which may use flamenco images and music to attract people to Spain, although as we know many tourists have difficulties finding flamenco when they get here.

It is not a simple question of is it important or not important as that depends entirely on who you are. A flamenco dancer from Jerez would think it was extremely important, whereas a steelworker in Bilboa would say it has no importance. Can you imagine asking how important Blues is in America ?

Kate

_____________________________

Emilio Maya Temple
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000CA6OBC
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/emiliomaya

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 6 2005 14:56:45

Kate

Posts: 1827
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: Living in Granada, Andalucía

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to sorin popovici)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sorin popovici
I couldnt find a newspaper that still has the news as I've heared it in 2004,
,but some of the story is here.I also listened to the mp3,
and I'm to say the least upset.I dont know if this was
a big story in Spain ,but in Romania it was ...and now imagine
me explaining to some romanian rednecks that not all spaniards
are bad.This should have been stopped at that time,we are
not living in the fifties, racism and xenophobia is not some
"new" phenomenon that they just cant control.

Hello Sorin,

I was horrified to read this article about the anti Rumanian song. I'm just pleased to say I have not heard it on the radio and doubt that anyone would want to sing along to it. It is unfortunate that in recent years Spain has attracted a large number of Rumanian criminal gangs which inevitably has coloured people's feelings to Rumanians as a whole. I recently had to go to the police station with a girl who had been attacked and we were asked to look at a really big photo album, full of known Rumanian criminals. I had no idea how big the problem was till then. However I have met several Rumanians who have been welcomed and live happily in Spain so not everyone here is racist and ignorant. You will see when you get here Sorin, Spain has many sides to it.

Kate

_____________________________

Emilio Maya Temple
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000CA6OBC
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/emiliomaya

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 6 2005 15:13:20

henrym3483

Posts: 1584
Joined: Nov. 13 2005
From: Limerick,Ireland

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to Guest)

if the admin is reading this, sorry if i caused offence by what i put up.
i was just illustrating my point.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 7 2005 11:36:19

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to henrym3483)

Henrym,
I thought it was funny myself...in fact I roared with laughter!
But we've got to be careful with crude stuff (in any language) as it could offend others and generally lowers the tone of the Forum.
No need to apologise.

cheers

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 7 2005 13:11:47

flyeogh

Posts: 729
Joined: Oct. 13 2004

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to Kate)

quote:

(flamenco) and often is used to represent Spain but this is far from the truth and can cause many Spanish people to be offended

To me Spain is a boiling pot of anguish, struggle and passion. This is of no great surprise if you study the civil war and its consequences. Family fighting family and at times even within families. And which side you fought for often amounted to calculating with whom you would be better off financially and had nothing to do with principal. And after years of Franco's supression.

[anguish, struggle and passion ] For this reason I would have thought Flamenco really wouold be ideal to represent Spain but as Kate says it is not. Spain is regionally disjointed in many ways.

Sorin I really wouldn't worry about any anti Rumanian reaction in Spain. Spanish people as individuals, in my experience over 30 years, are friendly and interesting. In any case there are other issuies like immigrants from Africa, the most insane lack of economy and opportunity, the fact that Zapatero was the saviour that they marched through the streets for only months ago and now lags in the polls, who will win the Liga (Real Madrid of course IMHO

) and many other new issues week by week. Today’s problem (except for who is going to win la Liga) is soon forgotten.

I just wouldn’t want you not to visit Spain for fear of racism and I can think of thousands of reasons why you should. It is a beautiful country full of contrastes with many delightful and friendly people, so go buy that Conde (or an Anders of course

)

_____________________________

nigel (el raton de Watford - now Puerto de Santa Maria, Cadiz)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 7 2005 14:05:29

henrym3483

Posts: 1584
Joined: Nov. 13 2005
From: Limerick,Ireland

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to Ron.M)

ron.m,

i felt like i needed to apologise, cause i'd hate to get kicked off this forum.this place is great.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 7 2005 14:05:44

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: what for a importance has flame... (in reply to Guest)

Kate there are many true things you said. Thus I have only few to add.

Its true; when I see a tv advertisement for a hotel in spain in german tv there is always some kind of flamenco music, rumba or buleria. I usually watch the whole thing, with the music and these beaches, and the hotels, and the sunshine, beaches , beaches

, beaches... and dream I would be there...

For most germans, the term spanish guitar and flamenco are very close to each other. But some also know the difference and some dont even know anything about these two.

I only know few about spanish history, but I know that flamenco people were long times opressed by the spanish (majority). And as we all know flamenco itself has great diversity, but its roots in the very very old oriental/arabic culture. Considering this context it makes me angry and sick if some spaniards try to occupy flamenco and stick it to the spanish island. This is just not honest. First they decilne it and then suddenly, if it fits their needs, if they see they can profit from it, since they have recognized that flamenco INTERNATIONALLY is very popular and liked, they use it to connect it to spain.

Unfortunately, as I mentioned the tv spot above, IT WORKED...

_____________________________

Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 8 2005 19:04:17