signed label

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signed label

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mezzo

Posts: 1409
Joined: Feb. 18 2010
From: .fr

signed label

I have a question about the signed label. There is a meaning in the luthier signature?
I mean is a signed label a garantee of a hand made labour?

Let me explain. My questions concern some guitars from cuesta Gomerez. After some search, I came across with this sentence : "...He also sells an estudio model with his label, made in valencia as do many makers in granada."
That confirm some other posts I read about the "manufacturing" help...

So in a case of a cuesta Gomerez' luthier who sell both, manufacturing and proper handmade, do you think he signed all the model or just the handmade?
My questions concern a used guitar from this area. If I try this guitar is there a way to spot out if it's a real handmade?

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"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 7 2011 22:48:36

bursche

Posts: 1182
Joined: Jul. 19 2007
From: Frankfurt, Germany

RE: signed label (in reply to mezzo)

There are definitely bad guitars which are signed!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 7 2011 22:50:48

mezzo

Posts: 1409
Joined: Feb. 18 2010
From: .fr

RE: signed label (in reply to bursche)

I have my doubts because the price is low so that would mean the owner has not paid too much for it

...or maybe it's just a good deal

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"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 7 2011 22:56:59

El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: signed label (in reply to mezzo)

quote:

He also sells an estudio model with his label, made in valencia as do many makers in granada."

This is true, I have a guitar I bought from Manuel Reyes in Cordoba and the label has his name and all on it (unsigned) and says "Guitarra de Estudio" the guitar is OK but you can tell straight away that it is not handmade, actually I think he said it came from Valencia.
The only thing he did was put the golpeadores on for me , and he chose that one for me , as he had a rack of about 10 of them and he played some of them and said "this one" ....

OK but why? are they not all the same?

they are all the same but this one seems to project a bit better,,........

Anyway why would a Luthier sign a bad factory guitar? as this would bring his reputation way down.......No Luthier would sign one , but they would sell some as a side line , kind of beginners guitars.....

However you could also get someone faking a lable or signature,..

Not sure about the luthier , you know Cuesta de Gomerez is a place,, Cuesta (Hill)
Gomerez hill is in Granada and there many Luthiers there

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 7 2011 23:31:45

johnguitar

Posts: 208
Joined: Jan. 10 2006

RE: signed label (in reply to mezzo)

There are about 30 guitar makers in Granada and the unspoken agreement is that if you sell a guitar with your label on it which you did not make you will not sign it. The answer to your question is yes, a signature is a guarantee of sorts. Sadly I know of a two cases where the guitar maker has signed guitars which are made in a factory in Valencia. To some extent those guitar makers are shunned by the rest because this is not the impression we want to give as a collective. The upside is that very few guitar makers here buy factory guitars to put their labels on even unsigned. If the "maker" is Antonio Morales you know it is a factory guitar.

John Ray
Granada

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 8 2011 6:48:44

mezzo

Posts: 1409
Joined: Feb. 18 2010
From: .fr

RE: signed label (in reply to johnguitar)

John thanks for your input

You answered perfectly to my doubt...is a A Morales!

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"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 8 2011 7:36:07

estebanana

Posts: 9358
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: signed label (in reply to johnguitar)

quote:

Sadly I know of a two cases where the guitar maker has signed guitars which are made in a factory in Valencia. To some extent those guitar makers are shunned by the rest because this is not the impression we want to give as a collective.

John,

How do makers in Granada feel about selling copies of other guitar makers designs or having their designs copied? It sounds like in Granada there is an ethical code of sorts, as an American, where nothing is sacred except money, I find that refreshing. Am I misguided in thinking that in Granada there is a collective, but loose system of ethical rule or debate between makers?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 8 2011 15:37:57

etta

Posts: 342
Joined: Jan. 20 2010

RE: signed label (in reply to mezzo)

Last spring I was in a guitar makers shop in southern Spain looking for a good guitar. I played almost everything he had including a 1a blanca. I finally decided on a shop guitar which to me sounded the best of anything there. I watched as the luthier put his label inside and joked with him about signing this roughly made but great sounding guitar. He did not sign the label, of course, but wrote a little something suitable for a tourist. This, for me, made the guitar special without his signature.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 8 2011 16:01:54