Rumba & 4/4 stuff

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Rumba & 4/4 stuff

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Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

Rumba & 4/4 stuff

I saw a little program on TV tonight featuring Cuban music.
Personally, I reckon that Spanish Rumba pales to a milky, safe, sing-along tune when compared to this stuff...
Sure, there was the Ida y Vuelta stuff etc....but IMO the South Americans took what the Spanish brought to a far greater height than anything the Spaniards ever brought back to Spain IMO.

NOBODY will ever beat the Flamencos at Soleá, Tientos/Tangos,Siguiriya and Bulerias.

But IMO credit for the development of that sweaty, sleazy sound from the rumba/4/4 stuff has got to go to the other continent IMO.

Pure Magic!

Like...Scottish folk music is nice and very sentimental...but it really takes going over to Ireland to find out what Celtic music is all about.

(Actually the younger bands here are now stealing the ideas back!

)

What do you think?

cheers,

Ron

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A good guitar might be a good guitar
But it takes a woman to break your heart

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 30 2008 8:10:41

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Rumba & 4/4 stuff (in reply to Ron.M)

There is so much fabulous guitar music from throughout all latin America.

Here for once classical guitarists cast their gaze beyond their navel. From the Brazilian Villa Lobos through Garroto and Pernambuco to the fabulous Baden Powell and the still with us Leo Brower. Not to forget the Venezuelan Lauro (the Venezuelan waltz is a brilliant rhythm and has many paralells with flamenco, seems though that only Paco Pena has payed it any attention ). Then there is the Argentinian Tango (although their most famous guitar export Jorge Morel leaves a lot to be desired) and the fine history of guitar there (check out Carlos Saura's Tango film for some great examples).

Latin America has give us guitarists so much.... the minor blues (farruca and rhumba) the breakdown of the andalucian cadence along the cycle of fifths (I will survive, Entre dos Aguas, every solea since nineteen sixty) the haunting use of the flat sixth dissonance over a minor chord (from Astor Piazzola through to Diego del Gastor and Paco) then there are the updated guitar techniques and textures of Barrios which are all through the music of the likes of Nunez.

South America invigorated western music by a wealth of indigenous forms (mostly in interesting polrhythmic triple times ) but also took the Cascada and Clave rhythms and embeded them in western harmony and melody in a way which no european singer has been able to escape since the mid forties, and no guitarist since Bo Didley.

Brilliant stuff. There is a great survey of various latin forms in Jorge Cardosa's 24 south american pieces (standard notation only for guitar solo) including his famous Milonga and some other excellent compositions. Every guitarist should own it.

D.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 30 2008 15:42:02

HemeolaMan

Posts: 1514
Joined: Jul. 13 2007
From: Chicago

RE: Rumba & 4/4 stuff (in reply to guitarbuddha)

way to say everything that could be said about that! lol jk

ron i agree. irish are better. even irish rock is outrageous, i'll cite black 47 as my fav irish rock band.

i grew up listening to irish and scottish music, i even took some time to check out the uilleann pipes (somehting i intend to continue learning).

to me, it takes a foreign perspective on trad stuff to really re-invigorate it.

i'm probably more excited about flamenco than most spaniards lol. and most converted christians are probably alot more excited about god than those who were born into it.

i guess when you find a folk music by choice rather than default it really amplifies it.

i know some south americans who are crazy about playing chicago style blues (and i'm crazy about charango so the relationship works out well lol) but could care less about the aymaran indians panpipe traditions lol.

as for the evolution of rhumba in the carribbean, wowy wow. i'm glad we have alot of that stuff in chicago, because chicks dig it big time.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 30 2008 16:28:51

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Rumba & 4/4 stuff (in reply to guitarbuddha)

quote:

ORIGINAL: guitarbuddha
There is so much fabulous guitar music from throughout all latin America.

And not just guitar music. I went to Cuba a couple of years ago and heard the most amazing rumba there - the polyrhythms of the percussion are just extraordinary. Traditional explanation is that it's the African influence from the slave trade. But I've spent a lot of time studying African drumming and went to Senegal to study, and though that was highly developed, it was nowhere near as sophisticated as the Cuban stuff. Perhaps it's the mix of the two?

Same explanation is used for Brazilian music too - that slaves from Angola brought their rhythms with them. Certainly on the north eastern coast of Brazil round Recife and Olinda the rhythms are much more funky than Rio samba IMHO. Can't beat a good Maracatu - you just have to join in!!

You spent some time in Brazil didn't you Ron?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 30 2008 22:30:04

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Rumba & 4/4 stuff (in reply to Ailsa)

quote:

You spent some time in Brazil didn't you Ron?

Yeah Ailsa,
The music is fantastic.
I love the way Samba permeates peoples lives.

I was hanging around a street in Rio with a small crowd watching a little Samba group busking, when a smartly dressed businessman appeared.
After a few minutes, he put his briefcase down and took off his jacket and started dancing with one of the girls there, with all the hip gyrations and everything.
When the number was over, he gave the girl a kiss on the cheek, put some money in the group's collection hat, put on his jacket, picked up his briefcase and walked smartly away to his business meeting.

Great!

cheers,

Ron

_____________________________

A good guitar might be a good guitar
But it takes a woman to break your heart

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 31 2008 1:29:45

flyeogh

Posts: 729
Joined: Oct. 13 2004

RE: Rumba & 4/4 stuff (in reply to Ron.M)

quote:

he put his briefcase down and took off his jacket

Not the Rio I knew, put it down and it was gone

But I remember kids less than 8 years old tapping out the rhythm continuously and without even thinking - hypnotic stuff. Don't know how they would get on learning something completely different after having that in the blood for years - do their hearts beat Samba?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 31 2008 1:52:47

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Rumba & 4/4 stuff (in reply to flyeogh)

quote:

ORIGINAL: flyeogh
Not the Rio I knew, put it down and it was gone

Yeah I experienced my only mugging in Rio. Someone snatched my necklace and I still have the scar where he dug his fingernails in. Sad thing is it wasn't worth anything, I doubt if he made anything on it. It looked silver, but it wasn't. I generally didn't feel unsafe, even around the samba schools on the edges of the favelas - just knew it was wise to be careful.

There were some really poor people around, and I remember once when we ate at a pizza place (world-wide food!) the waiter gave us what we didn't eat in a doggy bag. As we walked along the street some one called to us to ask for the bag. They knew it was a food bag. Think it was a well-developed system, and a sensible one. Here food hygiene laws would probably have confined the leftovers to the waste bin.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 31 2008 3:39:03