Paco - compositions vs covers

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Romanza

Posts: 296
Joined: Oct. 24 2005

Paco - compositions vs covers

Hi there
Was just wondering if anyone knows how much of Paco de Lucia's recordings are his own compositions, as opposed to covers of someone elses piece. I know its impossible to answer this question exactly, but does anyone have a rough idea? Say, out of his more famous pieces, which ones did and which ones didn't he compose? I love Mantilla de Feria on Entre dos Aguas for example, but apparently that's not his. Not that it matters, just curious. Perhaps this is too difficult..!?
Thanks.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 13:12:06

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

It's my understanding that almost all of his pieces are his own compositions.

Of the real famous ones, I know that Panaderos Flamencos, and I believe Impetu are by Mario Escudero (?). Things like El Vito or his South American albums are of course traditional folk songs. And then many licks or falsetas are traditional or traditionally, based, I would assume.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:13:27

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

quote:

I love Mantilla de Feria on Entre dos Aguas for example

Yes, I liked that song too. But I think its on "Fantasia Flamenca" not "Entre Dos Aguas" as there is no Entre album in itself (Entre is on the "Fuente Y Caudal" album). I was surprised that he didn't write it, as I guessed that he wrote nearly all of his songs apart from the ones that are traditional Spanish pieces. It would be interesting to find out exactly who the composers "F. Marafiot" and "E. Delgado" are and whether they collaborate with Paco regularly.

James

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:20:27

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Miguel de Maria)

quote:

I know that Panaderos Flamencos, and I believe Impetu are by Mario Escudero (?)

According to the "Fantasia Flamenca" cover, Panderos Flamencos is written by "Esteban Delgado".

James

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:23:55

Romanza

Posts: 296
Joined: Oct. 24 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

Hi James. I definitely have an album called 'Entre dos Aguas' and its amazing. Has some fantastic stuff - Chanela, Monasteria del Sal, Mantilla de Feria, Panaderos Flamencos on it etc. Maybe its a composition of some of his other albums?

So which are some of the more famous traditional Spanish pieces / folk songs, that Paco has recorded?

Many thanks.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:26:43

Romanza

Posts: 296
Joined: Oct. 24 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

Thanks Miguel - I love Panaderos too.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:27:34

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

quote:

So which are some of the more famous traditional Spanish pieces / folk songs, that Paco has recorded?

Now that you mention it I'm not exactly sure. Unfortunately, 99% of my Paco albums don't list credits for the songwriting (unless they are hidden amongst the odd paragraph of Spanish text, which I can't read!). If anyone knows which ones are traditional, please tell us.
As for the album "Entre Dos Aguas", yes, perhaps it is a compilation CD, as I own the box set of all Paco's 30 or so albums and its not in there.

James

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:32:47

Romanza

Posts: 296
Joined: Oct. 24 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to JBASHORUN)

quote:

Now that you mention it I'm not exactly sure. Unfortunately, 99% of my Paco albums don't list credits for the songwriting (unless they are hidden amongst the odd paragraph of Spanish text, which I can't read!). If anyone knows which ones are traditional, please tell us.

Yes thats my problem too.

quote:

As for the album "Entre Dos Aguas", yes, perhaps it is a compilation CD, as I own the box set of all Paco's 30 or so albums and its not in there.

Yes, looks like it is a collection: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000046MM/qid=1132764024/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl/026-7094350-5902864

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:41:43

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

quote:

Yes, looks like it is a collection: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000046MM/qid=1132764024/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl/026-7094350-5902864

Wow, for a compilation album, thats a pretty good selection... "Punta Umbria", "Guajiras De Lucia"... even "Rio Ancho". Not bad.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 15:53:42

Guest

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

Hola

You should realise that Paco uses themes from other music: classical, jazz, Brazilian etc. Sometimes he takes the whole idea and develops it: this is a classical and jazz based form of composition. Obviously, he has a lot of original ideas: as a musician, he is underrated.

Many years ago, someone asked Jack Bruce (bass with Cream) how he thought of his great bass lines. He replied: dont you know anything about classical music? I´m ripping off Bach, he has the best bass lines ever.

That´s what music is about: everybody learns from somebody else.

Suerte

Sean

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 20:09:44

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Guest)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sean

That´s what music is about: everybody learns from somebody else.

So true! It's like a writer, 99% of his work is made up of phrases and combinations of words that are in the common domain. And 99% of his effect is how he uses these combinations. But then there are innovators who expand the common domain, as well. I would say Paco's contributions come in both realms.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 23 2005 20:53:44

Ricardo

Posts: 14935
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

Esteban Delgado is better known as "Esteban de Sanlucar", who was from Sanlucar De Barrameda, but resided in USA where Paco probably discovered him being on tour with Jose Greco. Mantilla and Panaderos are his compositions. You can hear him play his own composistions on Vol 3 and 4 of "Maestros de la Guitarra Flamenca" series. He actually plays his own pieces just as good if not better than Paco did on Fantasia. Impetu is indeed Escudero's piece. Other than those 3, the majority of Paco's recorded works are his own composition. The obvious exceptions of course are with the collaborations with other artists and his 3 classical albums (lorca, falla, rodrigo). So that is a very LARGE body of orginal works from Paco. Remember some different titles have repeat falsetas but unique arrangements, depending on the year of the recording.

Ricardo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 24 2005 3:14:17

Romanza

Posts: 296
Joined: Oct. 24 2005

RE: Paco - compositions vs covers (in reply to Romanza)

Thank you Ricardo. I would like to check out those Esteban recordings to see how they compare. And Paco continues to amaze me knowing now the extent of his compositions..

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 24 2005 8:32:06