Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's

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Patrick

Posts: 1189
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Portland, Oregon

Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's

I just don’t get it. It seems like almost every guitar in Spanish flamenco videos and Onda Jerez broadcast are Conde’s. And I’m not talking about just a few; I’m talking almost every single guitar! On Onda Jerez today, I saw one rare non-Conde.

So what’s the story? It seems like all I ever hear is Conde bashings. No one seems to like them, yet….. Like I said, I just don’t get it. And not only do you see Conde’s used almost exclusively, IMO they ALL seem to sound pretty darn good. Most all seem to have that great Spanish “nasal” tone.

The Conde that Paco Cepero played today on Onda Jerez was the best I have ever heard. Now granted, that may have been him playing it, but it did sound pretty amazing.

I know, I’ve heard it all. All of the good ones are held for top performers. The bad ones are sent out of the country, on and on and on. All of this may be true, but the simple fact remains, you see these things everywhere. I guess this is more of a statement then a question. Just venting I guess.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 16 2003 23:47:51

Phil

Posts: 382
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Rota, Spain

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

Patrick,
I don't know if you saw my previous post about Condes, but I mentioned that they seem to be everywhere. Just how many Condes are there in existance today?. Someone else commented that they are to Flamenco what Strats are (or were) to rock guitarists. I was surprised to see Gerardo Nuñez playing a "blanca", since most concert style guitarists prefer "negras".

Tomorrow night you'll probaly see Moraito also playing a Conde. El Carbonero owns a Conde, but in the video that played tonight he was playing something else. I'll have to ask him what it was. God, that Conde guy makes a lot of guitars.

Phil

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 17 2003 1:26:56

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

If I had $6000 to spend, I'd go to Santa Fe and put in an order with Keith Vizcarra. The only famous person I've heard of that he's made a guitar for is Ottmar Liebert, but don't let that stop you--I played one of his guitars and fell in love. You know the feeling, where your fingers just dance, they flow downhill... and the sound, you immediately think, yeah baby, that's how it's supposed to sound!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 17 2003 1:49:04

Phil

Posts: 382
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Rota, Spain

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

Michael said,

quote:

If I had $6000 to spend, I'd go to Santa Fe and put in an order with Keith Vizcarra.

If I had $6,000, I'd go to Cadiz and talk to Sean O'Brian. I could probably buy 2 very good guitars and use what's left over to take my wife on a Medeterrean cruise.

Phil

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 17 2003 2:23:56

Patrick

Posts: 1189
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Portland, Oregon

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

Phil,

Yes, I did see your post on Conde's. You living in the heart of flamenco country must see a Conde on every street corner! With three shops, you are correct, they must really grind them out.

By the way. If you look on Ebay you will see a very rare Conde for sale. Rudy from FT forum has a 1977 Faustino Negra listed. If you have an extra eight to ten grand laying around, you can own it.

I am on Devoe's list, so no Conde in my future.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 17 2003 3:11:04

Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Phil)

Hi Phil,
Sean o'Brian in Cadiz, I was there end of May this year and got up on stage and played some Tangos in 'La Cava'
Forced on by my mates and only after a few glasses of vino tinto, but none the less was there and did it!
Cheers
Jim.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 17 2003 16:59:55

Guest

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Jim Opfer)

Jim

At the end of May I was in Ireland, trout fishing!

Sean O'BriEn

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 18 2003 20:30:16

Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Guest)

What! you didn't go to Seville?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 19 2003 8:25:43

Guest

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Jim Opfer)

The feria is worth a visit once. Just once.

Sean

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 20 2003 22:33:46

SantsMadrid

Posts: 13
Joined: Sep. 9 2011

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Phil)

quote:

Patrick,
I don't know if you saw my previous post about Condes, but I mentioned that they seem to be everywhere. Just how many Condes are there in existance today?. Someone else commented that they are to Flamenco what Strats are (or were) to rock guitarists. I was surprised to see Gerardo Nuñez playing a "blanca", since most concert style guitarists prefer "negras".

Vicente Amigo, Tomatito, and many others use Blancas for their concerts.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 9 2011 13:13:36

bursche

Posts: 1182
Joined: Jul. 19 2007
From: Frankfurt, Germany

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to SantsMadrid)

Yes, and those two normally play Reyes, not Conde.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 9 2011 15:03:30

Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

because Condes are the best guitar for flamenco.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 9 2011 19:09:45

Harry

Posts: 390
Joined: Jun. 24 2010
From: Montreal, Canada

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Ricardo)

As much as I want to disagree with you Ricardo, the proof is there for all to see. So many guitarists use Conde that it has become the guitar sound for flamenco. At the same time, not all Condes are created equal and I would never buy one without trying several to compare at least. Also, they cost an arm and a leg so it is risky. I think it is less of a risk to purchase from a well known builder.

Obviously well known guitarists don't pay for their Condes. The closest thing I have had to a teacher, (Oscar Guzman) told me that he was selling his guitar because he was given a Conde by a benefactor.

It gave me the feeling that getting a free and good Conde is like a sign of "making it" or something, kind of like a guitarist who gets sponsored by Fender or Gibson here.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 10 2011 12:08:13

Rmn

Posts: 308
Joined: May 14 2011

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

quote:

On Onda Jerez today, I saw one rare non-Conde.

any suggestions on how to watch Onda Jerez with a mac computer?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 10 2011 13:29:10

tele

Posts: 1464
Joined: Aug. 17 2012

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

Does anyone know, are the lacquered condes finished with nitro or poly lacquer? (old thread, sorry)

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 23 2013 16:32:02

Morante

Posts: 2184
Joined: Nov. 21 2010

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Phil)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 23 2013 16:42:04

Andy Culpepper

Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

I think this might have been the first thread ever created on Foro Flamenco.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 23 2013 23:56:09

Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to tele)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tele

Does anyone know, are the lacquered condes finished with nitro or poly lacquer? (old thread, sorry)

What difference does it make? IF it is not french polish it is EVIL!!!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 24 2013 20:57:59

estebanana

Posts: 9367
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Patrick)

I' ve been looking for some new Udon recipes, any ideas?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 24 2013 21:51:16

Northern Rock

Posts: 87
Joined: Oct. 12 2008
From: London UK

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Guest)

Hello is that the Sean O,Brien , classical guitarist from Aylesbury Bucks UK not sited by me Craig McTaggart since the early ninties.

If yes , how are you ?

If not pity !

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 25 2013 11:33:53

tele

Posts: 1464
Joined: Aug. 17 2012

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Ricardo)

I wonder why some people dislike properly done thin lacquer finish anyway(pdl uses one, too...). But I have figured out they used mostly poly lacquer on condes.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo

quote:

ORIGINAL: tele

Does anyone know, are the lacquered condes finished with nitro or poly lacquer? (old thread, sorry)

What difference does it make? IF it is not french polish it is EVIL!!!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 12:38:33

Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to tele)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tele

I wonder why some people dislike properly done thin lacquer finish anyway(pdl uses one, too...). But I have figured out they used mostly poly lacquer on condes.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo

quote:

ORIGINAL: tele

Does anyone know, are the lacquered condes finished with nitro or poly lacquer? (old thread, sorry)

What difference does it make? IF it is not french polish it is EVIL!!!!

Lot of nerds think it's bad for the sound, in addition to being toxic when applying, ugly when colored etc etc....

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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 14:30:08

Morante

Posts: 2184
Joined: Nov. 21 2010

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Ricardo)

I have an Alhambra steel string, lacquer finished, which sounds great, better then all the Martin´s I tried. The only advantage of french polish is that it is easier to repair.

Lacquer needs special techniques and a special spray cabinet, which is why small or one man businesses do not want to use it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 15:28:41

tele

Posts: 1464
Joined: Aug. 17 2012

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Ricardo)

I think lacquer looks better, is more durable and will not get dark spots on the back of the neck after long use. The thing in it that its not easy to do well, which is probably why some people dislike it. A thick lacquer layer can affect the sound supposedly

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 16:41:41

por medio

Posts: 289
Joined: Nov. 15 2009

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to tele)

This is an interesting point. I never really believed that french polish made that much difference to the sound of the guitar (I'm not winning any points with luthiers here).

Although I've never experienced stripping one's lacquer and applying French polish and comparing (by the way has anyone done the other way around and compared? I think this could be interesting).

I've just come across many lacquered guitars with great sounds and dud French polished ones (I'm sure many of you have too).

In saying that, French polish looks sooooo much better...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 18:41:00

Guest

[Deleted] (in reply to Patrick)

[Deleted by Admins]

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 19:14:39

gbv1158

Posts: 410
Joined: May 29 2009
From: Italy

RE: Conde's, Conde's and more Conde's (in reply to Guest)

quote:

Agreed imo no difference in sound between a (thin) lacquered or French Polished instrument.

I once saw a test with a precision acoustic detection instrument on two identical spruce tablets .......well.....there was a difference!
:-)
ciao
giambattista

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 27 2013 19:40:52