Baile accompaniment - Tangos question

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HolyEvil

Posts: 1240
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

Baile accompaniment - Tangos question

hey guys, I started to go to a dance school this week, for the first hr, I am the only guitarist and I've never play for dance without any other guitarist present before, I didn't realise that the proper guitarist wasn't there for the first hr.

I realised after those sessions that dancers and guitarist speak a slightly different language..

the compas of tangos to me is just a cycle of 4 beats..
it can be 2 cycles or 3 cycles or 4 cycles of 4 beats (playing compas) then falsetas then back to compas playing etc.

but at the school, the teacher was telling the students that the changes for their steps comes when i change chords. Then she told me to play the cycle of tangos, I have NO idea what she was talking about, and I haven't done tangos in 2.5 years, so I just play the compas the way my teacher told me using the chord changes he showed me etc..
then she counted the phrases and then at the end of it, told the students that's 1 phrase of tangos, and I counted that to be 8 cycles of 4 beats..

This is how I play it.
1 cycle = 4 beats
Bb -> A over 2 cycles
Bb -> A over 2 cycles
Bb over 1 cycle
C7(or some sorta C) over 1 cycle
Bb over 1 cycle
A over 1 cycle

then repeat

SO my question is that is playing for tangos baile ALWAYS or mostly phrased that way, like 8 cycles of 4 beats? so IF I play falsetas (which I won't, and also can't due to my i finger problem), I have to make sure they fit into this 8 cycle of 4 beats? And if I vary my chords, it always has to fit into this 8 cycle?

cheers

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 10 2012 11:25:13

marduk

Posts: 600
Joined: Feb. 3 2010

RE: Baile accompaniment - Tangos que... (in reply to HolyEvil)

I am only a beginner myself, But one thing that helps me if I want to try out a falseta at class, is to just wait for a llamada... I find that straight after the break you usually have enough time to safely throw in a falseta

sometimes I find letras that fit the choreography the class is dancing perfectly.. sometimes that makes it easier

sorry I cant help more, I am still new to classes too

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 10 2012 13:24:56

HolyEvil

Posts: 1240
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

RE: Baile accompaniment - Tangos que... (in reply to marduk)

quote:

ORIGINAL: marduk

I am only a beginner myself, But one thing that helps me if I want to try out a falseta at class, is to just wait for a llamada... I find that straight after the break you usually have enough time to safely throw in a falseta

sometimes I find letras that fit the choreography the class is dancing perfectly.. sometimes that makes it easier

sorry I cant help more, I am still new to classes too

hey slash!! The letra = singing part, which it's not as intense as llamada yeah?
how many cycles of 4 does it usually go for?

cheers for replying..

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 10 2012 22:16:23

Ricardo

Posts: 14828
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Baile accompaniment - Tangos que... (in reply to HolyEvil)

quote:

This is how I play it.
1 cycle = 4 beats
Bb -> A over 2 cycles
Bb -> A over 2 cycles
Bb over 1 cycle
C7(or some sorta C) over 1 cycle
Bb over 1 cycle
A over 1 cycle

What you call i cycle is actually a half compas by most peoples understanding. That is why dancers count one compas as 8 beats. Bb-A is ONE compas of rhythm.

So your whole "phrase" is 4 compases. That is a "cuadrao" phrase. It is a good idea to graft this concept of being cuadrao when you play to your inner rhythm map because it will really help you improvise when accompanying. You can sense that you need "one more" compas or whatever to make things feel nice and neat. groups of 4,8,12, 16 etc always feel "right". But sometimes there will be odd phrases with an extra compas or whatever, and it will all be fine so long as you feel it that way and can make your music match that.

The singing will have many different structures. Most repeated choruses or estribillos will be very cuadrao. Basic letras are similar to solea or buleria, 2 compas for first line, plus one compas answer for nothing, then repeat or change to Dm 1 compas, Repeat to E or G7-C 1 compas, C7-F or other cambio for next line of verse, and final line of verse resolve Bb-A. Often the last two lines of verse repeat (cambio C-F and final Bb-A). The total is 9 compases, just like solea. It would be a square 8 if you didn't have that odd answer the first line of cante.
Hope it helps.

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 10 2012 23:37:28

marduk

Posts: 600
Joined: Feb. 3 2010

RE: Baile accompaniment - Tangos que... (in reply to HolyEvil)

Ricardo answered heaps better than I could have.

quote:

hey slash!!

Tomatito has long hair too :)

a llamada is like a transition, I dont properly know how to explain it, but if you ask the teacher it should look pretty obvious. I find that they are usually pretty easy to catch in tangos.

each time i have to start a new palo at classes I try to learn the chords for at least one "verse" of singing, and an easy falseta. I mainly do this so that I can practice this stuff, while still giving the dancers something with strong compas

over time, you will end up knowing the arrangement and will start working out what to play in all the bits

try to get some time with the teacher (or an advanced student) and ask them to explain the choreography to you, and watch what all the different bits look like..

then go on youtube and jam along with 1000 different tangos

I hope this is helpful

listen to the chords he plays for the singer in this (typical tangos triana letra) thats the first one i used for tangos at class

Ricardo.... I want to encourage you to keep talking about this subject.....

one question I have, a lot of the time at class we dont have a singer, so I am just interpreting where the letras would be and stuff, and just basically trying to catch the breaks... and memorising the choreography so i can choose falsetas that fit..

sometimes there are lots of breaks.. I tend to play a (macho?) F - C then the typical llamada thing. but in recordings I notice the (i think macho is the right word) isnt always there.. can you tell me more about when we use that?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 11 2012 0:09:48