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IS THIS TRADITIONAL?   You are logged in as Guest
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JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

IS THIS TRADITIONAL? 
I recently purchased a Juan Serrano album from Amazon.co.uk called "Sabor Flamenco". I didn't have any other Serrano albums, nor had I heard any of his work, so it was all new to me. To be honest, there were only one or 2 Serrano albums available on Amazon, so I wasn't exactly spoiled for choice. I think this is album I got:

https://www.flamenco-world.com/tienda/shop.php?&vshopferca=aa2f409a241f4fbf0fc48027e550c5c7&op_shop=show&id_prod=937&id_cat=


My opinions of the album? Well, its okay- some nice catchy songs on there. But thats just the thing... I was under the impression that "traditional Flamenco" isn't this catchy.
I had a look at the back cover and there's a Rumba, a Castillian dance, a Danza Cubana, a Bolero Rumba, a Tarantas, a Bulerias, a Granainas, a Farruca, a traditional song called "Romance Flamenco" and a Sevillanas.
Now I'm guessing that the Castillian Dance and Danza Cubana aren't traditional, so that might account for some of it, and the Rumbas (well, everyone knows about Rumbas!). But even the Bulerias ("Patio Gitano") and the Farruca ("Luna Y Clavel") were quite catchy.
If anyone else has heard this album, I would be interested to know if this is really "traditional Flamenco" or just "modern Flamenco", as at this stage I find it hard to tell them apart. Also if anyone has any of Serrano's other albums, are they all this catchy and commercial or did I just pick the only one that is.

As usual, any informed opinions on the the subject are greatly appreciated.



Thanks,



James
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 12 2005 20:07:08
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to JBASHORUN) 
James,
I've only heard one Album by Juan Serrano.
It was a kind of a mixed popular/flamenco album, including tunes like "Autumn Leaves" and "Flamenco Impressions of New York".
It was OK.
One thing I can definitely say though...
The guy is a Flamenco Guitarist.
Absolutely IMO.
The compositions may not be, but you can't mistake that tone and style of playing.

cheers

Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 12 2005 20:38:50
 
Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005
 

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to JBASHORUN) 
What is traditional?? In 1000years the stuff they will invent in 500years will be traditional or forgotten than. So.. whats traditional??? All a question off time when it becomes traditional.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 12 2005 21:12:50

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to Doitsujin) 
Thanks, Ron. Yes, I don't doubt Serrano's credentials as a Flamenco guitarist.

But I think "what is traditional" partly comes down to compas. I was under the impression that there were about 10 different rhythm styles and anything within these was traditional Flamenco and anything outside it was not.
I think it might be helpful if anyone can direct me to a list of all the traditional Flamenco rhythm styles, and maybe tell me what some of the modern variations are too.


Thanks,


James
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 13 2005 10:59:12
 
Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005
 

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to JBASHORUN) 
Ok here is an article about the compas of some styles. I think every beginner should read and understand this aticle before taking the guitar in the hand for the first time.
http://rapidshare.de/files/7574437/winfield.pdf.html

some interesting. (I didnt read it..but shurely interesting)
http://66.249.93.104/search?q=cache:pEgmL2Bl4GcJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flamenco+flamenco+compas+examples&hl=en&client=opera

The book of G.Martinez is good with compasexamples I think.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 13 2005 13:29:01
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14935
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to JBASHORUN) 
Sabor is more recent (1990's?)and his technique is not what it was. I have the album Ron mentioned (1950's), and it sounds like a different guy all together. Really strong player with great ideas and clearity in his playing. I was surprised buy that record. Not sure if you can get it on CD nowadays. It is like the difference between Mr. Big and Racer-X.

Ricardo
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2005 6:46:14

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to Ricardo) 
Thanks Doitsujin- really good info there!


And thanks Ricardo, the comparison to Mr.Big and Racer X was a useful one. I'll try and track down the album you mentioned if I can. But for some reason, there don't seem to be many Serrano CDs about, which is a shame.



James
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2005 10:07:04
 
Jon Boyes

Posts: 1377
Joined: Jul. 10 2003
 

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to JBASHORUN) 
quote:

ORIGINAL: JBASHORUN
But I think "what is traditional" partly comes down to compas. .. I was under the impression that there were about 10 different rhythm styles and anything within these was traditional Flamenco and anything outside it was not.


No, first of all there are a lot more palos than that - 50 would be nearer the mark, and several styles are toque libre so strictly speaking don't have compas anyway.

IMO the traditional/modern differentiation is really about (1) harmony and (2) interpretation of the compas.

From a guitarists perspective, these days they play with a wider harmonic vocabulary and with a rather more complex regard to compas eg by playing with more swing -but that doesn't mean its not in compas.

Perhaps 'pre and post Paco' would be clearer

_____________________________

Spanish Guitarist in Devon, Cornwall and Somerset
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2005 10:44:12

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

RE: IS THIS TRADITIONAL? (in reply to Jon Boyes) 
Thanks for attempting to clarify, Jon. Its still a little hazy, but I'm getting there!


James
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2005 19:26:15
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