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paulw

 

Posts: 4
Joined: Feb. 5 2007
From: West Yorkshire, England

Juan Martin el Rey2 votes

Is it supposed to be cool or something to diss Juan Martin? Some peopole actually sound proud that they give him a hard time. Give the man some credit - especially if you're British; he speaks excellent English in his methodologies, explanations are good and, as has been mentioned before, takes time to tour outside of London. There are hundreds of electric and acoustic methods but a handful of flamenco and fewer in English. The man deserves an OBE for popularising flamenco in Britain - I for one would still be playing just classical if it wasn't for him. At the end of the day he's playing flamenco for a living; how many of those who criticise can say the same? He might not be the best - I'm not good enough to say but I'd give my right arm to be able to play like him. Er, actually maybe my right foot instead.

A los que solo hablan espanol - lo siento que mi castellano no me permite explicar en sus idioma. Suficiente decir soy aficionado de Juan Martin.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 20:43:41
 
ecgfc

 

Posts: 31
Joined: Apr. 18 2007
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

Muy bien Paulw. I also happen to enjoy his method/playing ...dunno what flaws, if any, he might have, the pros ought to enlighten us! Then again I'm new to this, so I'll be the last person to criticize anyone that plays anything :-D
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 21:37:14
 
koella

Posts: 2194
Joined: Sep. 10 2005
From: holland

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw)2 votes

Same old boring discussion: JM wrote a magnificenty method. So he's a good teacher and a magnificent business man. So what. That doesn't make him a number one player.
Compare him to an unknown and probably much poorer guitarist like Miguel Ochando ( youtube ! ) and draw your conclusion.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 21:49:11
 
XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw)2 votes

Why is it always english people that feel the need to defend him, and no spanish, and usually people that are new to flamenco. New people in flamenco is cool, but one should wait to judge on JM before one has not heard at least other guitarrists.

When someone would have given me JM's CD 4 years ago, i might have thought he is the best flamenco player in the world. Well...



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 21:53:51
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

El Rey de Que??

I can't help but agree with Deniz and Koella here...

So what is Juan the King of exactly?

Do tell.

(Please don't respond by saying teaching or getting people interested in Flamenco guitar....we've heard all that before.)

I'm beginning to think that the diehard Juan fans listen to nothing else.

It's almost like groupiemania and the Bay City Rollers.

duuuhh,

Ron

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 22:29:19
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

Yes. Juan is OK for those who want to find their way into flamenco guitar playing (he was also my first station before i switched to
Gerhard Graf Martinez, etc.).

Yes. Juan speaks good english. (much better than me )

Yes. Juan is a very good businessman.

Yes. Juan is a funny friendly nice guy.

Yes. For most of people who dont play Flamenco guitar themself, his music is as nice as Paco de Lucias or even better.

But NO. Technically he is not a good flamenco guitarist (comparing to hunderts of other guitarist which i heard during the last years, even semi-pros).
This is a fact and not an opinion.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 23:06:33
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 23:07:11
 
Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

I am with Ron, Koella, Deniz and Romerito.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 23:26:45
 
guitarbuddha

 

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

Frank Bruno, done wonders for boxing and pantomime. I can see a career for Juan one day.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 24 2007 23:57:41
 
andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to Florian)1 votes

we despise in others that which we most fear in ourselves



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 3:09:44
 
andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to andresito)1 votes

step into the light, children



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 3:11:09
 
Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

HAHAHA those 2 pics are brilliant !!!!


i am just so damn proud to be part of this forum !! i better go before i get emotional

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 6:11:33
 
andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to Florian

Thanks Flo!
I'm flattered I can make someone who gets glass thrown at their head get teary
I wasn't so busy at work today so I also had a chance to make a guitar fro Anders in the Luthiery thread

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 6:59:32
 
krichards

Posts: 597
Joined: Jan. 14 2007
From: York, England

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw)1 votes

I'm with you Paul

Your words might have been mine

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 8:57:46
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 9:12:02
 
Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw)1 votes

Ha ha.. The show must go on. If you are bored post a new JM thread. We need a new section here on foro flamenco. It should have the name SOAP. There we can post about Juan Martín, Bulerías compás, nails and strings.

I´m not a fan of JM but I totally respect him as a professional flamenco guitarist. Who am I to judge????? Commercial art is like that on all levels and in all artforms. What sells is what is wellknown. Incl. JM and Bay City Rollers. (They were cute. I had my hair cut like one them when I was 14 (sorry no picture))

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 9:47:38
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

It's unfortunate but all of his own making. He's a master self publisist.
He's often promoted as the greatest living flamenco guitarist yet he's not phased by this, he's happy to be described this way yet any normal person being missrepresented that way, would feel compelled to correct matters.
He know's he's not the best yet he thrives on that press.

This is the poster I was trying to upload under Ron's thread. Phew!



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 13:06:17
 
Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw)1 votes

U know , now that i think of it i have never ever seen Saddam Husein and Jm in the same room at the same time

i dont wanna start any crazy rumors but ..... .... they look very similar

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 13:50:13
 
ecgfc

 

Posts: 31
Joined: Apr. 18 2007
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to Florian)1 votes

I personally don't know if Juan is "El Rey", I do know Paco DL is the God (great ilustration & creativity btw)...& yes, some of us have listen to multiple "guitarristas." Niño Josele said it best by saying "Paco is light years away form the rest!"
I think the guy who made the thread was as curious as I am, who knows. I do believe however that if one is to criticize anyone, be it their technique,style, "purismo" or "apariencia", we ought be certain that we are, perhaps, as good if not better than the one being criticized. I for one, do not do so as doing so will be a sign of my "naivete" (IMHO!).
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 14:30:05
 
el ted

 

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 14:32:44
 
boral

Posts: 68
Joined: Apr. 27 2007
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to Florian

quote:

U know , now that i think of it i have never ever seen Saddam Husein and Jm in the same room at the same time

i dont wanna start any crazy rumors but ..... .... they look very similar



I think it is more like BORAT.... Who knows, flamenco from Kazakistan
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 15:06:18
 
wiseguy493

 

Posts: 73
Joined: May 9 2007
 

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

Juan is greatly over-promoted but I don't disrespect him for it.

I think his solo books are worthwhile tidbits to pick up on amazon.com for $15 per book

I think he's a good player, but nowhere near the best.

There are so many good players that are not publicized at all. A friend of mine recently visited Barcelona and brought back a CD for me that she bought from a guy who was playing on the street, his name is Anibal Palazolo. Anybody heard of him? I did some research and found a bio on him, found a few details of his education and that he's been to Argentina and some other little stuff but not much else. He has only published the one CD that I now have (and enjoy learning from... his Seguiriyas has quite a few fun falsettas). When he does publish another CD, I won't know about it and even if I did I'd probably never be able to find it.

Juan Martin is just a guy who has established himself in the market and published some books that are somewhat useful, even though there are certainly better method books on the market, and he's a guy who doesn't really need to or care to dispel the publicity he gets.

He has been around a long time, and he has been trying all that time to be famous, unlike many flamenco players. I think if somebody great actually publicized themselves the way Juan does, they would certainly take the spotlight off him, but so far none have.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 16:19:59
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14822
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to ecgfc

quote:

I do believe however that if one is to criticize anyone, be it their technique,style, "purismo" or "apariencia", we ought be certain that we are, perhaps, as good if not better than the one being criticized. I for one, do not do so as doing so will be a sign of my "naivete" (IMHO!).


Nah, anyone can criticize anyone else. Otherwise you end up with only PDL as the allowed music critic. Anyone can make a critique, but understand doing either a critique or a DEFENSE, reveals more about the CRITIC than the artist discussed.

Ricardo
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 16:56:45
 
paulw

 

Posts: 4
Joined: Feb. 5 2007
From: West Yorkshire, England

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

thanks for the replies.

Frank Bruno? yer 'aving a larf 'arry.

"I'm beginning to think that the diehard Juan fans listen to nothing else.

It's almost like groupiemania and the Bay City Rollers. " - so you know from somewhere that I'm a die-hard JM fan? - that's news to me that I am. And what's wrong with attaching bits of tartan to your trouser legs?

I am a beginner but if I get to the standard where I get so hung up on technique that I can't enjoy a JM performance I will have lost more than I will have gained. Time then to put away the guitar and take up subbuteo fishing.

donde hay la musica de Juan Martin, no puede haber cosa mala. - Spanish proverb
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 17:21:44
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

Paulw, where do you live?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 17:59:28
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 18:00:15
 
Mark2

Posts: 1872
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

Better dust off the fishing gear.


quote:

ORIGINAL: paulw

thanks for the replies.

Frank Bruno? yer 'aving a larf 'arry.

"I'm beginning to think that the diehard Juan fans listen to nothing else.

It's almost like groupiemania and the Bay City Rollers. " - so you know from somewhere that I'm a die-hard JM fan? - that's news to me that I am. And what's wrong with attaching bits of tartan to your trouser legs?

I am a beginner but if I get to the standard where I get so hung up on technique that I can't enjoy a JM performance I will have lost more than I will have gained. Time then to put away the guitar and take up subbuteo fishing.

donde hay la musica de Juan Martin, no puede haber cosa mala. - Spanish proverb
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 18:01:28
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to paulw

any body got some snacks?

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This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 18:49:55
 
Anders Eliasson

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RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to duende

quote:

any body got some snacks?

What about a cold Pripps

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 19:19:13
 
Per Hallgren

 

Posts: 241
Joined: Jul. 1 2006
From: Sweden

RE: Juan Martin el Rey (in reply to Anders Eliasson

I'm busy right now but there's some under the bench... väl bekommen!



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 25 2007 20:20:05
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