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szvarga

 

Posts: 55
Joined: Mar. 11 2019
 

Staccato rasgueado 

Anyone knows techniques to play rasgueados staccato? Both with thumb or without.
I've been trying to do that for a few days now, looking around on the web, but I didn't get anywhere...

Sz
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 10 2019 8:42:06
 
Stepan3356

 

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

Rasgueado staccato? What did you mean? when the thumb is bent?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 10 2019 9:51:52
 
szvarga

 

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Stepan3356

I mean staccato sounding.

instead of this:


sounds like this:


Sz

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 10 2019 10:58:38
 
JasonM

Posts: 1008
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

That phrase is probably played by muting the strings with your little finger after each stroke. Usually it would be be just down strokes with the index.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 2:40:58
 
edguerin

Posts: 1518
Joined: Dec. 24 2007
From: Siegburg, Alemania

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

Maybe what you'rew looking for is the famous rasgueo by Juan Maya Morote



and



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El aficionado solitario
Alemania
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 9:29:59
 
Ricardo

Posts: 11225
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to JasonM

quote:

ORIGINAL: JasonM

That phrase is probably played by muting the strings with your little finger after each stroke. Usually it would be be just down strokes with the index.

Yes if that’s what he actually means, but you can use up and down strokes. But I am not so sure that’s what he is after.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 14:04:27
 
JasonM

Posts: 1008
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Ricardo

Ah right, like in Alegria or SpB.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 14:41:18
 
Andy Culpepper

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From: NY, USA

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

Put a sock under the strings? To play that as written you would have to somehow mute in between each stroke which may not be possible at higher speeds (actually I would love to see that... Grisha?)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 16:37:53
 
kitarist

Posts: 636
Joined: Dec. 4 2012
 

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

Just do it in post-production

More seriously, not sure what the point is. What you present, the sextuplet of 16ths, surely this is meant to be played pretty fast to being with - implied with the chosen 16th notation. So you are already at a speed of, what, 400-500 strokes/min. What would be the musical intention of halving the length of the sounds?

BTW the current speed drumming record is about 1200 strikes/min with alternating hands; here you would have to get close to matching that, having to insert the muting with the left-hand pinky after each strike; however, you are also doing more complicated stuff with your right hand than the trembling 'murmur' that passes for drumming at these competitions. So good luck.

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 16:56:20
 
szvarga

 

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

On staccato I mean,... well I mean staccato:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staccato

(how else could i say?)

Thanks edguerin, the first video contains something i'm looking for. (In the second one, I couldn't find such thing)

I was trying some phrasing things with certain techniques, including staccato. With melody playing like picado or thumb, or even with arpeggio it looked applicable, but i was stopped with strumming techniques. And couldn't find any reasonable way to play them staccato.


JasonM
quote:

That phrase is probably played by muting the strings with your little finger after each stroke.
You mean your right or left hand pinky?

kitarist
maybe it was my fault, not indicating a tempo on my pictures, but please try to imagine a tempo of q=60-70 or less (a very slow solea, perhaps?) and the sixteenth notes then means much slower strokes than the world record of fast drumming...
Of course, try to playing staccato at a tempo as fast as the rest between the sixteenth notes cannot hold any longer to make a difference to achieve the staccato sound, is completely pointless.

Sz
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 19:11:52
 
gerundino63

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From: The Netherlands

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

Why don’t you give a sound sample, video sample or tell us on what cd you have heared it?
It makes it probably a lot easier.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 20:21:13
 
kitarist

Posts: 636
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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

quote:

ORIGINAL: szvarga
maybe it was my fault, not indicating a tempo on my pictures, but please try to imagine a tempo of q=60-70 or less (a very slow solea, perhaps?) and the sixteenth notes then means much slower strokes than the world record of fast drumming...


sextuplet 16ths at 60-70 per quarter, alternating with left-hand pinky muting after each strike, means functioning at a speed of 720-840. I guess your definition of 'much slower' is different than mine.

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 20:43:04

Piwin

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

left hand pinky, like here at 1:24:

Can't say I've seen it done in the middle of a rasgueado though. If you manage to play those sextuplets staccato at 60-70 bpm using this technique, I'm prepared to call you the pinky master.

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L'homme qui trouve douce sa patrie est encore un tendre débutant ; celui pour lequel tout sol est comme son sol natal est déjà fort ; mais celui-ci est parfait pour qui le monde entier est comme un pays étranger.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 20:47:50
 
szvarga

 

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to gerundino63

quote:

Why don’t you give a sound sample, video sample or tell us on what cd you have heared it?
It makes it probably a lot easier.


Because I never heard or seen it anywhere. Just tried to pairing strumming techniques (a-i-i, a-m-i-i, p-a-p) with staccato sounding. Maybe it is impossible, I don't know. But maybe something just escaped my attention, and somebody else know, how can it be done?

It's something like you play a picado line (or thumb) with very short notes. But playing strummed chords instead of notes.

Sz
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 21:05:03
 
szvarga

 

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Piwin

quote:

Can't say I've seen it done in the middle of a rasgueado though. If you manage to play those sextuplets staccato at 60-70 bpm using this technique, I'm prepared to call you the pinky master.


This little finger muting seems impossible to work at higher speed... But, whoa, imagine, how it would looks like? :))) Drrrrrrrrrrrr... Like a constant electric shock...
And sadly, it can be produced only with chords where the pinky is free.

It's the only technique used to mute strumming?

Sz
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 21:17:30

Piwin

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

That and just taking the pressure off the frets (doesn't work with open strings) are the only two I can think of that use the left hand. With the right hand all I can think of to mute all 6 strings at the same time is palm muting.

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L'homme qui trouve douce sa patrie est encore un tendre débutant ; celui pour lequel tout sol est comme son sol natal est déjà fort ; mais celui-ci est parfait pour qui le monde entier est comme un pays étranger.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 11 2019 22:23:13
 
rombsix

Posts: 6932
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

quote:

Anyone knows techniques to play rasgueados staccato?


Hombre, can you post an audio or video clip of someone demonstrating what you're saying you want to achieve? Perhaps there's some miscommunication going on here, because I'm not sure I've ever seen something done like what you annotated below with the sextuplet. Cheers!

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 12 2019 18:57:37
 
szvarga

 

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to rombsix

I can't, because I haven't seen it either... As I replied before:

quote:


Because I never heard or seen it anywhere. Just tried to pairing strumming techniques (a-i-i, a-m-i-i, p-a-p) with staccato sounding. Maybe it is impossible, I don't know. But maybe something just escaped my attention, and somebody else know, how can it be done?


It seems to me now, it is possible only with relatively slower single strokes, and a free left hand pinky (or right palm) to mute. And staccato doesn't work inside a rasguedo motion and/or faster speeds.

Thanks for your advices!

Sz
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 13 2019 9:11:41
 
Ricardo

Posts: 11225
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to rombsix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rombsix

quote:

Anyone knows techniques to play rasgueados staccato?


Hombre, can you post an audio or video clip of someone demonstrating what you're saying you want to achieve? Perhaps there's some miscommunication going on here, because I'm not sure I've ever seen something done like what you annotated below with the sextuplet. Cheers!


He never saw it because it’s impossible. Although I heard mike Dawes and Andy McKee are working on it

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 13 2019 15:42:12
 
JasonM

Posts: 1008
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From: Baltimore

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Ricardo

You could put a scarf between the stings like this guy. Plus it has the added bonus of letting all the ladies know that you are a homosexual.

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 13 2019 16:24:45
 
szvarga

 

Posts: 55
Joined: Mar. 11 2019
 

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Ricardo

quote:

He never saw it because it’s impossible. Although I heard mike Dawes and Andy McKee are working on it


Oh, no i don't think so. I'm sure, all of those guys destroyed their guitars, and stop acting like a fool right after You upbraid them.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 13 2019 18:05:34
 
Shroomy726

Posts: 1329
Joined: Jun. 5 2005
From: Argentina (living in U.S.)

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

I must agree with my fellow members here. I have never seen the staccato done in between each rasgueado stroke with sextuplets like you showed. That seems kind of impossible considering the speed it would require the pinky to move. The staccato technique on rasgueados usually happens after up/down strokes and the best examples I can think of that exhibit the faster staccato apagado style with pinky are:

Sabicas in Con Garbo Y Salero at 2:19 (demonstrated extremely well by our fabulous Grisha):

https://youtu.be/hwMWvTFqVFs?t=140

And for another apagado style on a non-index type rasgueado, I will commit heresy and use Juan Martin as an example of good technique:

https://youtu.be/irMld8whPbI?t=309

Look how fast those pinkies are moving already. It could be done faster but during a fast sextuplet rasgueado... I just don't see a way.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 20 2019 10:49:11
 
kitarist

Posts: 636
Joined: Dec. 4 2012
 

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to szvarga

quote:

ORIGINAL: szvarga
It seems to me now, it is possible only with relatively slower single strokes, and a free left hand pinky (or right palm) to mute. And staccato doesn't work inside a rasguedo motion and/or faster speeds.

Thanks for your advices!

Sz



And therefore, you might want to cool it down a bit with the eye-rolling emojis.

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 20 2019 16:22:26
 
Escribano

Posts: 5913
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to JasonM

quote:

You could put a scarf between the stings like this guy. Plus it has the added bonus of letting all the ladies know that you are a homosexual.


Well, that was boring, but it must have seemed like a good idea at the time.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 20 2019 17:35:06

Piwin

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RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to JasonM

quote:

Plus it has the added bonus of letting all the ladies know that you are a homosexual


Said the guy wearing nail polish!
If you approach it as "musique d'ameublement", that piece is pretty enjoyable tbh.

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L'homme qui trouve douce sa patrie est encore un tendre débutant ; celui pour lequel tout sol est comme son sol natal est déjà fort ; mais celui-ci est parfait pour qui le monde entier est comme un pays étranger.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 20 2019 17:39:08
 
Escribano

Posts: 5913
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Piwin

quote:

If you approach it as "musique d'ameublement", that piece is pretty enjoyable


Comme musac, peut-être?

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 20 2019 19:10:35

Piwin

Posts: 2301
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Staccato rasgueado (in reply to Escribano

Ah that's the word! I can't help it. I'm a sucker for that kind of stuff. Have you ever been caught singing over the on-hold music when customer service finally picks up the phone? Happens to me all the time. Catchy stuff.

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L'homme qui trouve douce sa patrie est encore un tendre débutant ; celui pour lequel tout sol est comme son sol natal est déjà fort ; mais celui-ci est parfait pour qui le monde entier est comme un pays étranger.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 20 2019 20:18:31
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