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I -hate- alegrias. Convince me not to   You are logged in as Guest
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mrstwinkle

 

Posts: 231
Joined: May 14 2017
 

I -hate- alegrias. Convince me not to 

Every time I hear the tri tri tri thing and the big cheesy grins appear on faces, my heart sinks. Not just the mannerisms, I've not heard anything they offer musically other than a break to go to the bar.

Yes, i know what the word means and the psychological evaluation you'll come to - probably correctly. Hey, I'm a segurillas guy...

So, anyone up to challenge of convincing me that there are some sort of alegrias out there that will change my mind. I feel I need to learn them at least passably, but need a mental hook in my head that doesn't put me off.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 10:54:35
 
henrym3483

Posts: 1393
Joined: Nov. 13 2005
From: Limerick,Ireland

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

For me, I have to be in a mood to listen to Alegrias. I like it with a rough round the edges sound, not the sugary sweet stuff that seems prominent in modern toque.

but like all flamenco palo's its worth listening to.

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 14:31:38
 
JasonM

Posts: 726
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

I hear that in Tirana all women are stunningly beautiful and dogs live to be 80 years old.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 14:42:20
 
Paul Magnussen

Posts: 1489
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

quote:

So, anyone up to challenge of convincing me that there are some sort of alegrias out there that will change my mind


Try minor ones — e.g. Paco Peña’s La Isla (from Flamenco Vivo), or Lucía’s Recuerdo a Patiño (from Fabuloso Guitarra).
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 16:46:02
 
Ricardo

Posts: 10830
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

Guitar wise, many agree this is his greatest composition:



Cante wise, the nuances in this melody at 19:18 .... try to play that melody on guitar in compas and enjoy it’s complex beauty that you never realized was inherent:



Here while the cante and guitar are not so dynamic as above, see how the pride, joy, and beauty of movement and rhythm can add a new dimension of depth to a supposed “light” song form:



Now if you are still intrigued by how that Poveda cante got to you and never noticed before, watch a real master from Cadiz, starting from 11:14 to conclusion:


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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 17:09:40
 
Dudnote

Posts: 1729
Joined: Nov. 13 2007
 

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

That's sooo funny - you say you hate alegrias and everyone bombards you with it

The tri-tri-tri thing is definitely overdone - it's nice when a singer ventures away from that standard opening.

I like watching this one 'cause Eva was hot back in the day


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Ay compañerita de mi alma
tú ahora no me conoces.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 21:26:01
 
Mark2

Posts: 1430
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

I really never got into alegrias until I started playing for dance. I think the form of the dance is super interesting for guitarists-you have the all the different sections. Personally I love the melodies. My only frustration with alegrias is that you really want to do the 16th note picados in this form, and alas, my picado doesn't work at that tempo. In my next life I'll spend more time practicing picado, and I'll start when I'm like three years old.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 21:40:36
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1372
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

Embrace the things you hate, you can learn the most from them about yourself.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 22:46:58
 
Dudnote

Posts: 1729
Joined: Nov. 13 2007
 

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to gerundino63

quote:

ORIGINAL: gerundino63
Embrace the things you hate, you can learn the most from them about yourself.

I wonder if that can possibly apply to our miserable neighours who complain whenever any musical activity starts going down.

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Ay compañerita de mi alma
tú ahora no me conoces.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 1 2018 23:25:55
 
Leñador

Posts: 5202
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

quote:

Embrace the things you hate, you can learn the most from them about yourself.

Very profound.

I used to hate alegrias when I first started. Now it's one of my favorites when done right. It can be done super cheesy though where it starts hitting garrotin levels of cheese and I have to tap out. But done right it's super cool, complex, nuanced, and difficult. It shouldn't be all smiles, many of the songs are about longing and for lack of a better term "saudade" as the Portuguese would say. Beyond the subject matter musically it opens up doors that the other palos don't, like interesting chord voicings and melodies.
I also developed my appreciation when I started accompanying dance. It pushes those 16th note up/down rajeos out of you that to me at least feel very metal(\m/) and not cheesy romantic at all.

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 0:12:54
 
mrstwinkle

 

Posts: 231
Joined: May 14 2017
 

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

Thanks all.

Lots of low-saccharin stuff there which makes a pleasant change.

Paco Peña’s La Isla is the one I like best of those mentioned, although going to minor feels like cheating somehow.

Alternative in major I heard in El Pasaje here in Jerez last night was speed up tempo to bulerias pace and lots of heavy rhythmic full chord strokes. But it was barely an alegria any more, more like alegria por bulerias if such a thing exists.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 9:14:18
 
orsonw

Posts: 1391
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

quote:

speed up tempo to bulerias pace and lots of heavy rhythmic full chord strokes. But it was barely an alegria any more, more like alegria por bulerias if such a thing exists.


Por baile it often ends in a bulerias de cadiz.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 10:45:55
 
tele

Posts: 1382
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

And I thought I was the only one who REALLY hated alegrias...

Well I must admit there are some that don't make my ears bleed...

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 14:10:04
 
Ricardo

Posts: 10830
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

quote:

Paco Peña’s La Isla is the one I like best of those mentioned,




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www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 15:33:24
 
Piwin

Posts: 2063
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

If you've listened to PdL's La Barrosa and walked away thinking "I hate this", then I doubt anyone can convince you there's anything worthwhile in alegrias.
quote:

Yes, i know what the word means


Careful with that. It's very easy to make quick associations and then let your conceptual understanding get in the way of hearing what is actually there. Saying alegrias is happy is just as nonsensical as saying a minor chord is sad. Both can be those things, but they can also express a myriad of other emotions, which you just won't hear if your head is stuck on this notion that "alegrias equals happy" or "minor chord equals sad".

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"When I'm dead, I'm going to forget everything – and I advise you to do the same."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 16:09:56
 
edguerin

Posts: 1478
Joined: Dec. 24 2007
From: Siegburg, Alemania

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to mrstwinkle

A while back I asked my teacher in Sevilla, how come "Alegrias" had letras like:

Están puesto en balanza
Dos corazones a un tiempo
Están puestos en balanza
Uno pidiendo justicia
Y otro pidiendo venganza

which after all isn't particularly "happy" ... His answer was "that's Andalucian humor"

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Ed

El aficionado solitario
Alemania
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 17:18:10
 
mrstwinkle

 

Posts: 231
Joined: May 14 2017
 

RE: I -hate- alegrias. Convince me n... (in reply to tele

Welcome to the good taste club :)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 2 2018 21:23:23
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