guitar action ajustment

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etta

Posts: 342
Joined: Jan. 20 2010

guitar action ajustment

I have a luthier made guitar, but to get the action down where I like it, 3mm or less, the saddle has been reduced to about 1mm exposed on a very light and thin bridge. This puts the strings at only 5-6mm above the sound board at the bridge. This gives very little break angle over the saddle. The fret board looks very straight with little relief. What is the best solution for keeping the action low and at the same time installing a taller saddle? Is planing the sound board the best solution or can the problem be corrected by other methods? The guitar is over 20 years old but has great tone, lots of punch and volume. I think a taller saddle would only improve it. Any suggestion please??

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 28 2017 13:46:39

estebanana

Posts: 9351
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: guitar action ajustment (in reply to etta)

Show it to Stewart Port over in Oakland or someone with equal experience and ask them to evaluate the neck angle. You might get a little from planing it, 5-6mm off the fingerboard indicates possibly the board is already too thin. It's one of those situations that needs a real eyeball on it. Assuming you're not going to do the work yourself, just take it to someone.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 28 2017 23:29:39

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: guitar action ajustment (in reply to etta)

quote:

I think a taller saddle would only improve it. Any suggestion please??

I've worked on several guitars to try and get better action; mostly lowering the saddles or raising them and I have found that doing any of this will alter the articulation and or tone to be different in its out-put, however so slight.

Sometimes lowering the saddle can be beneficial to relieve certain torque problems by easing top tension, but to a player with skills, it can produce a fraction of movement that will make the guitar sound and play differently.

Most of the time, raising the saddle will add torque and cause an undesirable change. I've seen the added torque cause dead spots in the voice, on occasion.

Perhaps it might be better to address the fingerboard height, rather than take more wood off the bridge.

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 28 2017 23:35:10

estebanana

Posts: 9351
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: guitar action ajustment (in reply to etta)

On second thought, if you have 5 mm and 6 mm, and under three at the 12th, just make a 1 mm thick shim and put it under the saddle. If you raise a saddle from that low over the top to 7 mm you're not going to change the set up drastically, you'll probably be right around 3 mm at the 12th which is normal. The very worst thing that can happen to you is that the guitar will play cleaner.

If that does not make you happy, try another half mm of shim. 7.5 bass and 6.5 treble is lowish on a normal set up, and probably about as low as most set up works. If you were at 9 mm over the top and wanted to go higher, then you will begin to mess with the overtone activation a start jacking up the sound by activating too much.

As far as break angle, it's an interesting topic, generally the consensus today is that you want at least 11 degrees, but as little as 6 will work. This is based on some testing carried out by Al Carruth - and it's empirical in so far as the tests were evaluated by players who tested the guitars blindly. There has been some builder/ engineers who dialed up the 11 degrees number also. There was also some testing coming out of Carruth's shop that said hyper angled break over the saddle has quick diminishing returns on performance. In other words and 45 degree or a 30 degree break angle is not buying you much more sound than a 15 degree angle.

That said and your question about break angle providing you more sound or 'Ummph', if you already have anything around 10 degrees you're probably fine. Adding a 1 mm tall shim won't really change the guitar in a dangerous way, or intensify the so called torque, you are pretty much bottomed out, so the question I would ask is what is your threshold of comfort at the 12th fret?

And then to take that farther, some players feel every guitar they have should have exactly the same set up at the 12th fret, I'd caution against accepting this as the right thing to do. One guitar might work well with the string under three at the 12th and another might not. But since you're guitar is pretty much bottomed out and you have a lot of headroom for higher adjustment, I'd experiment with shims and not worry about 'torque' or the 12th fret height at first.

Take a ruler and razor blade and make a shim, and after that experiment if you are locked into under 3 mm at the 12th fret, then take it to someone like Alan Perlman or Stew. If you like the shimmed up saddle have one of them make you a new saddle at that height.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 29 2017 0:10:54