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jg7238

 

Posts: 2870
Joined: May 11 2009
 

A question about social anxiety 

I had a question about this... I know many people suffer from this. How do you manage this problem not only during performances but in any social event? It can affect your way of living. It gets tricky when you have confidence in your playing but lack it in other areas which can affect a performance. Anybody? Please don't say you need to see a shrink.😄
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 11:35:11
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

IMO, simple breathing exercices can go a long way. Even just the ol' 3-deep-breath thing helps.

On the longer run, I think social anxiety can be tamed. But like any skill, you have to practice it. In my case, from time to time I try to put myself in a situation where I know I'll "do bad". For instance, I've taken some dance classes (which is quite possibly the one thing on earth I suck most at...) in settings where I knew absolutely no one. Though I did give it an honest try, it wasn't so much about learning how to dance than about overcoming the anxiety. For severe cases, even just knocking at the neighbor's door to ask for salt can be challenging. But even there it's the same idea: putting yourself out there, in the situation you're not comfortable with until at some point you end up feeling more comfortable.
Basically put, I don't think it's about feeling confident all the time. Rather, it's about getting comfortable with the feeling of lack of confidence. I don't know if that makes any sense, but it works for me

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 11:53:47
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to Piwin

Of course if everything else fails you can always go see a shrink. Badum ching (that was the drum outlining a lame joke)

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 12:05:11
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to Piwin

seconded ....i would go with the shrink thing ......


in the performance thing , i do get a bit of stage fright before going on , i always did ..but i always had a quiet moment first the went on stage ...
I think about the music and the sound and whats coming up and a whole load of things to do with the performance .. ''dont forget this and do that etc ....' that kind of puts my mind off other things ...


It gives the impression of confidence , I think, without really having any
once things get going ., I actually do forget Im in front of people , and another me switches on ..so afterward I dont remember maybe as much as i should ,, always thinking of whats next and not what was ..




A social event is more tricky , depends on what the event is , whos there and what is expected of you
I think most people , used to it or not , have this problem ,, its about speaking in public , addressing an audience when all attention is on you ...but your not any different to anyone else .. thats one thing you have to realize , everyone has a bit of this , and the only way to do it is to do it ...

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 13:17:31
 
etta

 

Posts: 347
Joined: Jan. 20 2010
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

"George Dickel"-Tennessee's best whiskey.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 14:56:53
 
DavRom

 

Posts: 310
Joined: Jul. 16 2015
From: De camino a Sevilla

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

a bottle of wine

done.

you can pay me later

edit: damn etta. i'm off anything stronger than wine, but same idea
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 15:12:31
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Have a drink, it's social lubricant.

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 15:49:35
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to Leñador

not for everyone ... cant play when I'm drunk , and too uninhibited in social situations ....singing , dancing on tables , dropping me trousers ... regrets tomorrow though ....

Still......

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 15:54:21
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

It's a bit of a fine line but I really believe the perfect amount can make you charming, good looking and maybe even taller.

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 16:03:08
 
Sr. Martins

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RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

Anything external is only a temporary bandage. (in this case, alcohol)

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 16:08:35
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

You should make a poll. At this point we're 3 in favor of dealing with your sh** and putting yourself out there
and 3 in favor of drinking your way through anxiety.

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 16:16:26
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3454
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to Leñador

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leñador

It's a bit of a fine line but I really believe the perfect amount can make you charming, good looking and maybe even taller.


The question is where to draw the line. I used to have a T-shirt that had TEQUILA printed on it in big letters. The heading was followed by four lines. The first showed one shot glass, followed by "I'm good looking." The second line had two shot glasses, followed by "I'm rich". Three shot glasses were followed by "I'm Brilliant." Four shot glasses had "I'm invisible!"

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 16:22:40
 
Estevan

Posts: 1943
Joined: Dec. 20 2006
From: Torontolucía

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to Sr. Martins

quote:

Anything external is only a temporary bandage. (in this case, alcohol)

No, it's meant to be applied internally.

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Me da igual. La música es música.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 17:57:13

payaso

 

Posts: 85
Joined: Dec. 7 2014
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

Alcohol is not usually the answer. A very good book is The Inner Game of Music by W.Timothy Gallway _ a really helpful guide by an experienced musician..
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 18:17:01
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

I think used properly and responsibly it can be really useful.
ASIDE from alcohol Juan, anywhere you go there's a 99.9% chance your the best guitar player in the room. That should make you feel like your automatically the coolest guy in the room. Every guy wishes they could play guitar and you do it better than most. Just keep telling yourself. "I'm a dope ass guitar player, these people would LOVE to talk to me."


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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 23:00:20
 
julianev

 

Posts: 78
Joined: Apr. 13 2015
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

I think it depends on the specifics of where you lack confidence, and how that manifests as an impact on your way of life. My nemesis has always been any group social situation with people I don't know well. Music has been a big help in my life with that as it creates a level of indirection: it feels like people are interacting with my guitar playing rather than me, and so I feel a lot more comfortable! The bad bit is mostly after the gig when I then have to attempt to make small talk, etc

Doing something significantly different/challenging from time to time has also helped, as a change of perspective. Some years ago I spent time trekking unsupported in the Himalayas, and for months afterwards my social anxiety was much reduced as it felt inconsequential compared to the awe-inspiring grandeur of the mountains and crappy living conditions of many of the Nepalese.

As regards impacting your way of life, it depends on what the impact is. If it is stopping you doing something you really want to do, then I'm in full agreement with Piwin's advice about getting comfortable with the feeling of being uncomfortable! However if it is just something you feel obliged to do due to peer or family pressures, then I say acceptance of your social anxiety and cutting out those situations is the way forwards - there's nothing wrong with disliking social situations, and life's too short to waste it on pointless things you don't enjoy
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 23:16:04
 
estebanana

Posts: 9539
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

Social anxiety is a big subject for artistic - creative people. Many would have had much better beginnings at their careers if not for socialization difficulty. I was not a 'people person' in any way when I was young in my 20's and I was doing great work. I had to evolve into being able to engage with others.
Many artists who have social anxiety are already brilliant, deep thinkers and souls with integrity and drive. Just remember that. Then drop into a good therapist and start talking about. For some it is about self esteem issues that cripple them in social situations and for others there are greater factors at work. Some who suffer social anxiety issues have very complicated pathologies that should be evaluated by a good therapist. Most however are wrapped up in self esteem issues.

In the US artists are not culturally valued enough, or are culturally undervalued, either way you want to say it. And family dynamics around self value and art is a big problem for artists in the US. A lot of this is what drives artistic creatives to self medicate with alcohol and worse. Prescription drugs for anxiety are not always relevant or needed, and the latest studies in therapy practice and medical research has shown that prescription drugs to quell anxiety have been prescribed in an overreaching manner. The up to date psychologist today is not handing out handfuls of pills.

Stage fright is natural and probably a realistic state of being as a performer. You can hear veteran performers say they get nervous when laying it on the line with new material, but with maturity as a performer comes some added confidence that you will get through. It is important to distinguish between stage fright and a more global form of social anxiety. Stage fright in itself might be healthy, whereas not being able to function as a whole person or under crushing psychological pressure in other social situations is quite another problem. Although they share components of fear and questioning, each one should be be looked at to understand where they begin and end. They have similar triggers, but the cure for stage fright is to finish the show. The cure for general anxiety is to look at why and how it is triggered and then work through those issues with a professionally trained helper.


That all said, if alcohol or drugs are not used as a continual self medication trip that causes or extends the anxiety, well then an analeptic swig or two can help smooth some rough edges in conversation. But if the drinker finds them self at parties hovering in less populated sector staring into a glass of beer rather that engaging others, well then drinking is probably not so good.

One thing you can do right away is to read about our great role model artists, writers, creators on the subjects of culture and how artists fit into society. There are interviews and essays by many artists about how they deal with anxiety, self esteem and how we as creative workers both fit and do not fit into society. I listened to an interview many years ago of Jean Genet speaking about his life. He said artists, meaning poets, film makers, writers, visual artists and all the rest, go at society at an oblique angle. He said they hit society at an angle, and like a bullet something in artists ricochet off of society and does not get absorbed. he spoke in some finny metaphors about the problems of alienation that artists in particular have because we are making a challenge to normality in culture, or to what is accepted. When I heard that I began to look at other examples of artists dealing with the problems of coming at society from an angle. I lot of confidence can be gained by hearing well known high level pros talk about confidence issues. Everyone has them and when you understand that you feel it is normal. Feeling normal about pressures resulting from artistic careers and pastimes can really help to move through the challenges of anxiety.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 23:20:43
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1762
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

I have done some researche about this. Maybe this will help.
Anxiety is someting you can train to get rid of. Try it, it might help you.



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 20 2016 23:34:57
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to Leñador

i'll drink to that........

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 1:45:01
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to El Kiko

no dont do the drink thing ..its false ...wont help you in the real world ..unless you manage to constantly stay drunk ..then that would be you real world ?? i guess ...

last time I came home , if I had my guitar , I may have knocked it a bit out of tune dur to bad judgement and timing ....yes , walking home out of compas



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Don't trust Atoms.....they make up everything.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 2:15:09
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to El Kiko

quote:

no dont do the drink thing ..its false ...wont help you in the real world ..unless you manage to constantly stay drunk ..then that would be you real world ?? i guess ...


In that case, I'd suggest that psylocibin or DMT would make for a much more interesting alternate psychological state than alochol would. .

No one has yet mentioned the fact that social anxiety and/or stage fright can also have somewhat of a beneficial effect. I've heard many people tell me after a performance (at a show or at a social gathering) how the additional adrenaline had sharpened their minds.
I've heard flamenco artists speak about being able to play things during a show at speeds they hadn't achieved during practice. It's uncomfortable from a 1st-person point of view, but on the whole it may just be a good thing, not something to smooth out or get rid of. I guess it depends on the amount of anxiety. Obviously, if there's so much anxiety that you keel over like one of those fainting goats, then you'd have to do something about it. For anything less though, I wouldn't necessarily see the anxiety as only a bad thing.

_____________________________

"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 9:14:16
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to El Kiko

quote:

yes, walking home out of compas


I may have spontanously cried out "Olé" when he somehow pulled off a somersault over the railing and down the stairs.

_____________________________

"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 9:22:02
 
Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010
 

RE: A question about social anxiety ... (in reply to jg7238

Computer emulation

As you may know the brain processes impressions independently from realistic probability of a scene (which is why e.g. movies become part of one´s apparent experience involuntarily).

The good thing to this is that cyber experience will actually train you similar to real world experience. A fact long known and employed with flight simulators for training pilots.
On a same token it was found that car racing video games do improve driving skills in real life. Just as shooting / war games improve reaction in real, etc.

Thus computers and simulation are already being engaged in therapy too.
The most thrilling example -as I found- being that criminal mind sets can apparently be re-programmed by inducing reasonable association to given images.

The latest example of emulation have been in recent news.
Now regarding use of those cyber headsets that simulate one´s position and movement in 3D room.

Examples shown were patients suffering from vertigo, and others fearing the subway.

Obviously the cyber situation even though triggering anxiety just like the real thing, presents a great way for the patient to train in a controlled situation. Thus sensing security / adapting much easier than in a real-life training.

From there I could think of an interactive app for performing artists, emulating an audience to train against social anxiety. (Imagine with levels for advanced trainees even showing rumbling audience. If getting through that one should become quite immune.) I´m sure it wouldn´t even take presence of a therapist for such an application to be of help. One could simply train at home, just like car racing kinds in the neighbourhood.

When it be released, I might fetch me one too.

Ruphus
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 9:49:05
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15318
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

Social situation: learn and memorize a whole bunch of jokes, tasteful of course, and appropriate, and learn to deliver them at the right moments. That always breaks the ice.

Sports and music: pretend you are a sports or music hero figure. Just manifest that personality over top of your own. It really works. Even PDL said he did this (Melchor de marchena) in order to accompany Mairena (both performer were nervous before the historical event). After many times of doing this, ones OWN personality will cut through and eventually you don't have a problem being yourself.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 16:16:57
 
DavRom

 

Posts: 310
Joined: Jul. 16 2015
From: De camino a Sevilla

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

it seems we're talking two situations: stage fright and agoraphobia (social situations specifically)

there is no permanent cure for these, only temporary relief and/or tempering through exposure. that is, the more you put yourself out there the better you get at coping. but there is no cure

as for stage fright in particular, i'm always wary/suspicious of any performer who says they don't get it or they have overcome it somehow
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 21 2016 16:57:27
 
estebanana

Posts: 9539
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

No, no.no Agoraphobia is a pathology, it is different from social anxiety because of social conditioning and lack of self esteem and other factors.

People who suffer from being poor performers in social situations can blossom into self confident self reliant actors in the world with the right help and encouragement.

Agoraphobia is very extreme and it can also be helped, but anyone playing guitar in public and getting stage fright is not agoraphobic, nor is a person who has trouble at work or at parties. Real fear of open spaces or social situations to the point where a person will not go into them or suffer a severe panic attack is fairly rare.

Totally separate subject.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 22 2016 0:17:04
 
DavRom

 

Posts: 310
Joined: Jul. 16 2015
From: De camino a Sevilla

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to DavRom

Re-read my post
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 22 2016 2:07:34
 
jg7238

 

Posts: 2870
Joined: May 11 2009
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to estebanana

Thanks guys for the comments... Actually I've said it before; and that is to me there is nothing better to have than a shot of Cognac Courvoisier(Le Cognac de Napoleon) before playing or to just relax a bit.... I have played out in the past including Carnegie Hall (Weil Recital hall) a couple of times but have turned out lately into a bedroom/house guitarist. ... Nobody has met me in person so to those that think I cannot play for people or give a good concert might want to reassess their thoughts. @Gerundino: thanks for that. It looks very helpful. @Ricardo: Thanks for chiming in.. @Stephen: Thanks for the comments.

Again, thanks for all the replies everyone.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 22 2016 4:20:54
 
estebanana

Posts: 9539
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to DavRom

quote:


Re-read my post


I understood your post. Agoraphobia is curable. It is a pathology and not everyone one who has social anxiety problems is an agoraphobic. Agoraphobia is described as an acute and debilitating panic attack triggered by open places and unknown surroundings including unknown public places.

A person can suffer from anxiety in social situations and not be agoraphobic. Many of the pathologies like agoraphobia described in the DSM today are being reevaluated by clinical psychologists- in the past with the development of a systemic description of pathologies contained in the DSM a kind of blanket has been cast over many people suffering from symptoms that are seemingly the same,but triggers for symptoms and problems are extremely varied. There has been a of misdiagnosis of anxiety related disorders and confusion between anxiety driven mental health problems and acute disorders. Some anxiety issues are not pathological disorders listed with formal names in the DSM and can be changed with good counciling and work.

I could go on but I won't bore you guys. But the gist is the DSM is no longer the end word in who has what issue because psychologists are finding more and more that labeling a problem and looking for a list of symptoms to check of fin the DSM is less and less reliable for understanding what is really happening to a person.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 22 2016 10:44:40
 
estebanana

Posts: 9539
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: A question about social anxiety (in reply to jg7238

quote:

Thanks guys for the comments... Actually I've said it before; and that is to me there is nothing better to have than a shot of Cognac Courvoisier(Le Cognac de Napoleon) before playing or to just relax a bit.... I have played out in the past including Carnegie Hall (Weil Recital hall) a couple of times but have turned out lately into a bedroom/house guitarist. ... Nobody has met me in person so to those that think I cannot play for people or give a good concert might want to reassess their thoughts. @Gerundino: thanks for that. It looks very helpful. @Ricardo: Thanks for chiming in.. @Stephen: Thanks for the comments.


If I were going to play in Carnegie Hall I would have a one ounce bracer of aged single malt scotch about 15 minutes before curtain. In order to knock any further stage fright that might happen mid performance, I would invite Bill Barkel to wave the scotch bottle at me from the wings to encourage me to play well and persevere.

Well, needless to say I'll never perform at Carnegie Hall and I am impressed that you have. If you ever want to split a bottle of scotch three ways between you me and Bill, well name the venue. I'll drink at Weil Hall, or Wigmore or ........or ..or ......

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Feb. 22 2016 10:59:08
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