RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act

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Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

This is a very beautiful turkish song as well, from a very interesting film about Istanbul and its music(' Crossing the Bridge', highly recommended):

Cheers!

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2013 0:58:54

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

Hmm, I didn't know that is ' Microtonal singing' , I will look that up tomorrow (getting late here). Was interesting exchanging thoughts!

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2013 1:01:42

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

More fusion there but more accomplished. I loved all the bits but not so much the whole. Kinda sounded more Celtic than anything.

Here is a dying musical tradition which maybe highlights some ancient and unforced fusion of cultures.

D.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2013 1:01:49

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jurriaan

Hmm, I didn't know that is ' Microtonal singing' , I will look that up tomorrow (getting late here). Was interesting exchanging thoughts!

Funny thing is that there is less and less microtonal singing in blues based music in the west. I love Nina Simone singing I Love You Porgy and here control and confidence is amazing. A lot of the eastern singing I have heard is really awesomely accurate in its intonation and the effect is visceral.

It was all over Rock and Pop till recently but autotune karaoke and half assed failed opera singers teaching pop seem to be killing it. Lots of songs lose all power if sang in equal temperament. Classic example GNR's Paradise City.

So blah blah, we all love music.

D.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2013 1:10:11

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jurriaan

This is a very beautiful turkish song as well, from a very interesting film about Istanbul and its music(' Crossing the Bridge', highly recommended):

Cheers!

Reed flute at the very start ? lovely.

Will check the film out. Girls first entry sounds a bit to prim and westernised like a bollywood voice over artist.

D.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2013 1:11:23

wdbrs

Posts: 4
Joined: Jul. 5 2012

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Guest)

I have to go with V.M. Bhatt, from India, who I heard first in collaboration with Ry Cooder on the album A Metting by the River. He has done some very interesting collaborations with other western musicians as well.

Here is a pure indian clip:

And here is a track from the album Bourbon & Rosewater, with him and Jerry Douglas:

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2013 11:55:19

Guest

[Deleted] (in reply to Jurriaan)

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2013 10:49:44

BarkellWH

Posts: 3458
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Guest)

John Fahey is one of my favorite non-flamenco guitarists. John Fahey passed away in 2001, but from the late 1950s on, and particularly in the 1960s, he played a steel string acoustic with a great finger-picking style learned from some of the old blues legends. I still have his vinyl album entitled "The Transfiguration of Blind Joe Death," and my favorite piece on the album is entitled "Orinda-Moraga." Great, almost hypnotic, finger picking guitar.

Cheers,

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2013 21:12:02

estebanana

Posts: 9351
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

Coltrane - 'Live at Birdland' early 1960's

Afro Blue from same album:

And from the album 'Crescent' for 1964:

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https://www.stephenfaulkguitars.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 23 2013 2:13:51

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

Wow, Will that indian song ('Raag Kirwani) is simply amazing, thanks for sharing that (I have dowloaded that song and will listen to it more often). Regarding ' fusion' versus 'pure' music, I would like to give a dissenting opinion; all music is a mixture of previous styles of music (take flamenco, which is a fusion between Indian, Spanish and Arabic influence) and no music is 'pure' (in the sense that is totally new). I wonder what the Indian influence on flamenco is though (must be the compas as the melody is what guitar buddha would call 'microtonal' - smaller intervals than the smallest interval in Wetsern music, the half note).

I also like dvider's Turkish banjo music. And now that we have been talking Turkish and Banjo, I think it is necessary to talk Oud, and would like to introduce mister Simon Shaheen to you:

Enjoy!

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 24 2013 22:08:53

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

I don't disapprove of musical blending. But when the stew aint ready it shows. Mind you I still love brave talented people overreaching.

Here is Raphael Fays.

Notice the similarity to the UD player in the free right hand.

Here is Weiss, on the German copy of the earlier fretted Arabic lute (fusion from the dark ages). It was on this instrument that the prelude and fantasia appeared which seems to be an early attempt to copy the freeform styles of the eastern players. This form had a great influence on Weiss and through him Bach.

(thanks to Eric Van Goch for introducing me to the performer on the Cello thread)

Here is an article http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/lute/hd_lute.htm

D.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 24 2013 22:39:30

Guest

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 24 2013 22:49:56

wdbrs

Posts: 4
Joined: Jul. 5 2012

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

Whoops, stumbled on a land mine there with "pure." Yeah, I totally agree with you guys, all music is fusion, only some of it is new and some a more stable, long established mix. Now in my defense, I actually meant to say "puree" *cough*, as in "to prepare by blending."

I loved that Simon Shaheen piece. I actually knew about him already because he too has done a collaboration with V.M. Bhatt, check it out:

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 25 2013 11:30:47

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

Ok glad we agree and good to know that is was actually a misunderstanding because your puree comment makes perfect sense ;-). Wow, I didn't know that composer - sounds a lot like Bach (my favorite composer) indeed (love it). I wonder how long it takes to tune that instrument with all those strings...

It seems that I have to check out some more stuff by mister Bhatt because this song sounds amazing too (liked the previous one better though). The wrist movement they use on the Ud (and what the gypsy jazz guitarist is doing) looks a lot like the quick wrist movements used for wrist rasgueados to me (also the fast pulgar in flamenco reminds me of the fast string picking with that kind of plectrum they use on the Ud).

Well, thanks for the amazing input - I look forward to speaking to and learning from you in future threads (going to check that cello one out by the way).

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 25 2013 21:51:58

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

It's all good Jurrian.

I think maybe you missed the music of the Wee Free Kirk, which I posted above a real oddity. Couldn't be more Scottish couldn't sound any more alien.

I am glad you picked on the ud/gypsy guitar/pulgar think. I first mentioned it here about eight years ago and you are the first to pick up on it. I also see buskers from Peru and Ecuador playing like that in the streets of Glasgow, Micheal Pouris also on his bazouki.

I also look forward to talking with you about music.

D.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 25 2013 22:29:28

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Jurriaan)

Haha, yes that celtic singing session was a bit odd indeed. And although the Scottish are of course hard to beat in being odd, I think these two Mongolian guys pulled it off:

Looking forward to future discussions

Jurriaan

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 26 2013 21:50:15

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to Guest)

Since Garoto came up and he never seems to get mentioned as often as he should here he is playing some kind of mandolin (it's called a bandolim) I think.

Garoto is the missing link between Bach and Bossa Nova.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 28 2013 0:28:29

guitarbuddha

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to guitarbuddha)

Here is a rollicking swing version (I couldn't find a good solo guitar rendition on youtube and mine needs work).

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 28 2013 0:35:16

FredGuitarraOle

Posts: 898
Joined: Dec. 6 2012
From: Lisboa, Portugal

RE: Favourite non-flamenco guitar act (in reply to guitarbuddha)

quote:

here he is playing some kind of mandolin (it's called a bandolim) I think.

Mandolin and bandolim were originally the same instrument, bandolim is the name in portuguese. However, nowadays there may be some differences, just like the cavaquinho and the ukulele.

Here's a bit of portuguese guitar, which derives from the bandolim: