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Who is"real" flamenco/ who is not?
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LaVaquera
Posts: 41
Joined: Jun. 2 2013
From: South East USA for now
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 RE: Who is"real" flamenco/... (in reply to guitarbuddha)
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[/quote]
However 'World Music and Cultural Appropriation' may be more germane in this instance (it is a long standing field of study in sociology).
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Guitarbudda: You mentions something interesting. I just now learned a new term. I had not heard of Cultural Appropriation until now. (Sorry...I am an immigration lawyer, not an anthropologist.) It seems to fit, when considering that just about anything with rasgueado is called Flamenco in the U.S.A. I found a book called Flamenco: Conflicting Histories of the Dance . by Michelle Heffner Hayse "Anxious traditionalists fear that the current popularity of flamenco in a global market threatens to eradicate its 'orthodox' roots. [...] In order to save flamenco from extinction, by those authority must it be 'rescued' from its practitioners? and, what are the cultural and economic implications of demystifying flamenco? Flamenco has a long history of upper-class patronage and exploitation... It becomes increasingly difficult to discuss the 'cultural appropriation' of flamenco when some respected practitioners sand scholars of the art come from outside Spain, from countries such as Japan and the United States." I can see how Cultural Appropriation is at the same time a blessing and a curse. I thought this article was interesting: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/16/world/europe/flamencos-foreign-saviors.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0 Flamenco’s Foreign Saviors
My Spanish speaking teenage clients, used to Mexican pop music, enjoy the Gipsy Kings music on the long rides to out-of-town immigration court. They experience much of the same stigma as the gypsies seemed to have felt. If I can relieve some of their anxiety by perky little tunes, it helps. They are well worth the money I spent on the CD. It is a good introduction to the kids, for expression of emotion through music as done in traditional flamenco. This genre seems to fit with the tragedies this population experiences with families being broken by harsh immigration policies of the USA, plus it is in a language they are more familiar with than English. Their indigenous cultures get denied and erased even in their own countries, as Spanish culture came into Central America to conquer the Mayans, who are the present displaced populations in the Americas. As for traditional flamenco, I play those CDs in my own time.
Diane aka La Vaquera
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Date Jun. 5 2013 0:44:56
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BarkellWH
Posts: 3458
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC
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RE: Who is"real" flamenco/... (in reply to LaVaquera)
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quote:
It is a good introduction to the kids, for expression of emotion through music as done in traditional flamenco. This genre seems to fit with the tragedies this population experiences with families being broken by harsh immigration policies of the USA, plus it is in a language they are more familiar with than English. Their indigenous cultures get denied and erased even in their own countries, as Spanish culture came into Central America to conquer the Mayans
It is interesting that you extoll the virtues of traditional flamenco (a Spanish art form) as an expression of emotion that is valuable to your clients, while seemingly condemning Spanish culture as conquering the Maya in Central America. Are your clients Maya? Are they Mexican? It hardly matters, as the Spanish conquered both, yet the Spanish have much to offer in terms of culture and music, in this case flamenco. And if the Spanish cultural context fits in a niche for your clients, so be it.
I would take issue with your characterization of immigration policies of the US as "harsh." The United States has one of the most liberal legal immigration policies of any nation. US immigration policy is primarily based on family unification, while most of the world's immigration policies--Canada, Australia, the United Kingdom, and many others--are employment-based, i.e., what is in the best interest of the country of intake. I believe you are referring to illegal immigration when you speak of "harsh," but it has always been one of the signature elements of national sovereignty for a country to determine who to accept as immigrants. There is a big difference between legal and illegal immigration.
And when you describe US policy toward illegal immigrants as "harsh," harsh compared to what? Do you know how Mexico handles illegal immigrants? Do you know what happens if illegals are caught in Honduras? Germany? France? Japan? Turkey? Believe me, US policy toward illegals is very benign compared to much of the world. And we will eventually have another program to legalize our illegal population, just as we did in 1986. Official US immigration policy since 1965 has been anything but "harsh." The US takes in about one million legal immigrants annually. That is a pretty generous immigration policy. And we are working to eventually resolve our illegal population problem as well.
Cheers,
Bill
_____________________________
And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."
--Rudyard Kipling
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Date Jun. 5 2013 1:31:44
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LaVaquera
Posts: 41
Joined: Jun. 2 2013
From: South East USA for now
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RE: Who is"real" flamenco/... (in reply to BarkellWH)
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To Bill, aka BarkellWH:
Oh, heck yes. I definitely call the US immigration policy harsh. From top to bottom. However this is not a forum for immigration policy. My reference was merely for the purpose of explaining the depths of emotional sadness I see people in. I ask that further discussion about immigration policy be directed through off-list messaging, to keep our listmates from getting frustrated at the two of us. I could go on for many paragraphs about it, but the point that was making when mentioning it is that these kids are going through a lot of mental and emotional pain that I have to try to deal with somehow. Families are being unfairly torn apart, and nothing else can be said about it except that it is emotionally wrenching. I see a lot of comparison to how the Romas were treated historically. All I was trying to say is that music helps soothes their mood for a few moments.
It is unrealistic to think that just because I enjoy something that came out of Spanish culture that I cannot criticize any part of Spain or its history. That is not criticizing all of Spanish culture. Historically, when Spain's Ferdinand and Isabella were financing convoys to the New World, they were also financing Torquemada, the late 15th-century Spanish Dominican friar and the first Grand Inquisitor in Spain. It was Spain's inquisition that brought the persecution of the Moors, Jews and Gitano. Ferdinand and Isabella, in 1499, initiated a long stream of anti-Gypsy legislation that lasted until Charles III’s reign in 1783. The sorrows from the Spanish Inquisition helped shaped the diversity from whence came Flemenco culture. This is a culture worth celebrating because of the universality of suffering as part of the human condition.
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Date Jun. 5 2013 3:11:32
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