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Which is better guitar: Luthier flamenca, Esteso EF4, Manuel Reyes 6-36???
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luis_valdes
Posts: 3
Joined: Jan. 5 2005
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 Which is better guitar: Luthier flam...
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Which is better guitar: Luthier flamenca, Esteso EF4, Manuel Reyes 6-36???
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Hi, I would like to someone help me to chose which of these guitars has better sonority, playability, its soft, and "mango" more confortable, the prices are very similar, Im just seeking the best option becausea i have never listen one o these guitars, these are the models: ALHAMBRA LUTHIER FLAMENCA, ESTESO EF4 O EF5, Y LA MANUEL REYES JR DE ESTUDIO MODELO 6-36, all prices are around 2200 dlls, thank you very much I hope to get a lot of information about it thanks and we are in contact...
Hola, quisiera que alguien me ayudara a decidir cual de estas guitarras tiene mejor sonoridad y tocabilidad, es mas suave, y mango mas comodo, los modelos son en precios muy similares, solo busco la mejor opcion ya que nunca he escuchado ninguna de ellas en persona, los modelos son los siguientes: ALHAMBRA LUTHIER FLAMENCA, ESTESO EF4 O EF5, Y LA MANUEL REYES HIJO DE ESTUDIO MODELO 6-36, todas estan al rededor de los 2200 dlls, muchas gracias espero recibir mucha retroalimentacion, gracias y estamos en contacto...
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Date Jan. 5 2005 10:37:14
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Guest
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to luis_valdes)
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I would give the edge to the Manuel Reyes 6-36 of the two. The Ricardo Sanchis Carpio 2AF I would agree is another good choice, but all of these are factory guitars. What i would recomend in this price range is the Rafael Romero model 120 or 150, or the Jesus Bellido Taller Flamenco. These are true luthier built guitars from fine makers.
Dr. James B. Greenbertg
Zavaleta's La Casa de Guitarras
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Date Jan. 9 2005 16:59:33
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Guest
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to luis_valdes)
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James
Could you please define a true luthier built guitar?
And how many pairs of hands are allowed in the production of a true luthier built guitar?
Thanks
Anders
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Date Jan. 10 2005 7:56:01
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Guest
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to Guest)
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A luthier built guitar in my book is one that the maker whose name is in it
builds himself.
There is little question in a shop were a luthier works by himself--
Felix Manzanero, Casimiro Lozano, Jose Lopez Bellido, JA Pantoja Martin.
Andres Dominguez, Santos Bayon, Angel Benito Aguado, Juan Alvarez,
Jesus Bellido are examples that come readily to mind.,
In some instances, a luthier may work with a couple of assistants
or apprentices who help with less critical routine tasks but the critical work is done by
the luthier himself. Examples, Rafael Romero, Tezanos Perez. In some cases
the guitar is made in partnership with another luthier-- Hernandez y Aguado
is a famous example, but others include Pedro de Miguel, Pedro Maldonado
who works with his two sons, Ignacio Fleta y hijos, Paulino Bernabe and son.
I would also classify these a luthier built instruments as the time and effort that goes into
their construction is the same as for those working alone.
By contrast, in small factories many hands are on most guitars, a larger
percentage of the work involves power tools, although perhaps 60 percent
of the work is still done by hand. Even where, for example, in traditional
factories where models are assigned to worers based on experience, the level
of production of these factories means that much less is spent on each guitar.
These are best called production guitars.
James
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Date Jan. 10 2005 14:39:28
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Guest
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to luis_valdes)
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Thanks James
I mostly agree with what you say, especially in the point you mention about people working together, with sons or friends, and putting the same time and effort into the building as a luthier working alone. These guitars are Luthier made guitars to me as well.
I only want to add, that in some small places, the Luthier has someone comming to do routine jobs, and these can be many, bridges, bending sides, gluing the plates together and even passing the same plates through the drum sander or making the entire neck/heel/head. Leaving almost only the assembly to the luthier whos name will appear on the label.
These are not luthier made instruments in my opinion. They are small scale production guitars. What is interesting is that some very famous names fall into this category. I'm not going to mention any names, for the obvious reason that I build myself.
Anders
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Date Jan. 10 2005 14:57:53
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Ricardo
Posts: 14801
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to luis_valdes)
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quote:
The Ricardo Sanchis Carpio 2AF I would agree is another good choice, but all of these are factory guitars.
Factory guitar or not, from a players perspective, I would choose this guitar, sight unseen, for a flamenco performance over most other "Luthier made" guitars in the same price range. Carpio is a very "flamenco" guitar, perfectly acceptable for accompaniment or solo, and that is more important than wood/tools, or the number of hands that made it. I have not played a guitar w/ compareable treble response, in that price range. Frankly, I find that maker to be undercutting the market for what you get in terms of sound and feel. This is my opinion as a player. And I don't even own one.
Ricardo
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Date Jan. 12 2005 7:22:22
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Guest
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to luis_valdes)
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Ricardo,
In my opinion you are comparing things that cannot and should not be compared. Just like supermarket tea cups and handmade ones.
A handbuild guitar from a good luthier, will always have something that a factory guitar will not have: personality, being made for you, posibly all made by the luthier, including rosettes, design etc. The factory guitar will always be serial production, everyone alike, just like buying a Toyota, which is a nice car.
Some people do not care about these things. They like funcionality and thats it. That this means that it makes everything look the same, doesn´t matter. Personality is not interesting for this consumer, just funcionality. These costumers buy Carpios, Yamahas, Condes. I dont even compare my own guitars to these guitars, not because I think they are better. Its just something else, and people comparing my guitars to factory guitars, they should buy the factory guitar, because they do not valuate my work.
The Carpio is a very nice guitar for the price, I do not agree with you in that you cannot find other nice or maybe even better guitars in this price range, and I know you havent played everything on the market. Me neither.
The problem in this discussion is defining what is handmade and what is not. And this because everyone call their guitars handmade. Even the cheapest Alhambra, Esteve etc is called handmade , and they even use the spanish word, artesan, which is far out IMO. Another problem is that many builders say that they make everything themselves, when they dont do it. It makes for an unfair comparision for the builders doing everything themselves.
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Date Jan. 12 2005 11:33:48
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Guest
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RE: Which is better guitar: Luthier ... (in reply to luis_valdes)
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Sorry, forgot to put my name on that last message, I'm Anders. Just cant log in at the moment. The server is not sending me a new pasword.
Anders
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Date Jan. 12 2005 11:35:51
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