When artists play with a net

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gato

Posts: 322
Joined: Jun. 9 2007

When artists play with a net

I don't know of any worse or agravating thing in music than when any kind of Artists perform with a net. Who want's to go along with that? People just put up with it, and I don't really think it's that uncommon either, I mean in the age of television it's what we are brainwashed to expect, but in concert? Waste of money. So why do people go?

Artists who perform with a recording suck!
This is a bust!

Gary

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 20 2009 18:47:09

bursche

Posts: 1182
Joined: Jul. 19 2007
From: Frankfurt, Germany

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gato)

There is a certain level of complexity that makes it impossible to fake a performance.
Because of that virtuosity is quite an important thing to me.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 21 2009 5:16:10

val

Posts: 800
Joined: Apr. 4 2007

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Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Nov. 8 2010 13:27:24

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 22 2009 5:35:23

gato

Posts: 322
Joined: Jun. 9 2007

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to val)

Yes val, it's an American expression, it refers to when people play a tape and mime or fake the performance, and it's quite common in entertainment. And the expression perform with a net, means they don't have do admit that they sing badly. I think a lot of people know who perform. Maybe it's an inside kind of thing to be aware of. People are easily fooled by the situation of having someone who is bigger than life get up on stage and his or her presence.....

Gary

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 22 2009 19:16:48

gj Michelob

Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gato)

I would imagine singers will do that occasionally. At times it is not even their choice, particulalry when a number of singers will perform in a swift succession.t There would be no time to fine tune everyone's amplification to one's liking or specs: hence the regretfully deceiving "lips-singing" or "play-back".

However, I never heard that instrumentalists will resort to a net, like a flamenco guitarist.... is there such a shameful case?

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gj Michelob

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 22 2009 20:37:36

gato

Posts: 322
Joined: Jun. 9 2007

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gj Michelob)

???

That's a scary thought. 'Lip sync guitar', I could imagine that a guitarist who makes a video over a mulititrack arangement could fake a single passing in the video performance. But then, who would buy that? I mean this Hollywood stuff in the flamenco? Naaaaa.

You've got to use your head. What is real and what is not is a matter of perception, and the next step from that would be to play the multitrack recording in concert, and fake it so it looks like a performance on one guitar. Naaaa.

With all respect, solo guitar is solo guitar and any maestro who records an album in multitrack arrangements, is still indeed making solo guitar work. How do you present the same exact music in concert on a single guitar? Naaaa.
Real solo guitar is different.....

Hollywood fake 'lip sync' stuff, it's for the birds! It doesn't happen in the flamenco!

But, the thread wasn't really refering to that and I really ment that virtuosso work really is superior, and after all you can tell! Hollywood is the real perpatrator that I have seen. Do you remember the 90's when pop stars use to dance and sing in concert so vigorously that it would be so hard to sing and dance at the same time let alone grunt with a little microphone clipped to their ear and protruding from thier jaw? Now that was blatant, and that was lip sync. People would be at the concerts and scream and yell, and yet, there was no band! My god, everyone knew, but that's what all of the stars did. Everybody loved it! That's what this thread is about and I'm not going to be the one to hijack it.

Now I am pulling your leg!

It's the audience who's in question.
Gary

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 22 2009 22:34:30

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gato)

I think those who go to a playback concert or whatever dont expect or want artistic virtuosity anyway, so its not a big deception. In flamenco this is generally different.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 23 2009 2:53:07

Jenny

Posts: 97
Joined: Mar. 13 2007
From: Oxford, UK

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gato)

Someone pointed this vid out to me and said they reckoned it was done 'with a net' (I've never heard the phrase before either) - ie mimed.. But he's Vicente! Surely not..

I can't tell actually - am pretty good at spotting vocals, drums etc but not guitar miming for some reason. Any ideas?

Cheers,

Jenny

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 23 2009 9:53:38

gj Michelob

Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to Jenny)

quote:

Someone pointed this vid out to me and said they reckoned it was done 'with a net' (I've never heard the phrase before either) - ie mimed.. But he's Vicente! Surely not..
I can't tell actually

A few of his Videos (Vicente's) do give that impression, that he is miming simulating a live-performance, see for example:

At times, I would suppose it is due to a reasonable disconnection between video and sound but.... it is possible he is playing with a net.

In the Video you linked, the clapping must be from a "playback" source, anyway. Therefore we are already dealing with hidden tapes to some extent.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 23 2009 10:14:42

bursche

Posts: 1182
Joined: Jul. 19 2007
From: Frankfurt, Germany

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gj Michelob)

In the Soleá there are several cuts.

Usually those TV-concerts aren't played in a single setting.

But guitar playback ???

I'm sure every other guitarist could reveal that at once.
And here it doesn't look like this.
At the olympic ceremony its hard to tell from the distance, but I don't think he does it.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 23 2009 11:47:52

HolyEvil

Posts: 1240
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gato)

I think it's a waste of time watching performances where they are lipsynching. You are just paying to watch them move around or dance on stage. Unless they are Jessica Alba, I will not pay money for that.

For musical stuff, like mentioned, I can't imagine any musicial worth their salt would ever fingersynch to their guitar. It's an insult to them, their art and their fans. Only ok for playing with a pre recorded track is when there are multiple guitars in the song, and one guitar just can't cut it. Or a pre recorded flute section or something.
But only if the main instrument is not synched.

I don't mind a guitarist with a drum machine or a drummer with a synthesized guitar part, but not the other way around.

cheers

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 29 2009 15:50:36

gato

Posts: 322
Joined: Jun. 9 2007

RE: When artists play with a net (in reply to gato)

Well at least you all get the gist of this thread. The next thing is to realize that we are no match for multitrack recordings when we play au natural. I mean it is to say that people play guitar for years not realizing that much of their album collections of classical and flamenco guitars are multitrack, and there is no way to play like that alone on one guitar.

I like to play and develop my natural guitar style, and it's a challenge to compete with studio recordings. When ever I remember I pat myself on the back with a smile and re asure that I am not that bad after all. I mean let's face it, real natural human ability alone by itself is rare indeed. But, I'm not going to sit on a worm hole looking for it!

Gary
Be good to yourself.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 30 2009 0:16:28