Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Full Version)

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ChiyoDad -> Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 1:47:34)

I've noticed that Francisco Navarro and some other luthiers use cedar for the tops of estudio flamencas. I'm assuming that this helps lower the cost of the student guitar.

Doesn't the use of cedar take away some of the brightness of the flamenca? Or is the difference irrelevant because the luthiers can compensate in other ways?



Pgh_flamenco -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 1:59:59)

I read about cedar being a good wood for soundboards on a website. If I can find it again I will post it here. I would assume cost is the main factor, but I can't be 100% sure.



Anders Eliasson -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 7:45:38)

ChioyoDad.

If its for cost, its because the maker is going to cheap. Cedar is a first class soundboard material. I like it for negras but prefer spruce for blancas. You can build bright with Cedar as well..

With respect of being suitable for student guitars, well it has one disadvantage and its that its soft, so golpes outside the tapplate makes DEEP scrathes and students tend to make golpes all over the place



ChiyoDad -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 12:41:18)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anders Eliasson
If its for cost, its because the maker is going to cheap. Cedar is a first class soundboard material. I like it for negras but prefer spruce for blancas. You can build bright with Cedar as well..

Thanks for the info, Anders. I'll go ahead an investigate some of the cedar estudios that I've seen.



C. Vega -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 12:55:41)

One big reason why so many Spanish-made student level classical and flamenco guitars have cedar soundboards is that Spain's biggest supplier of lutherie woods, Maderas Barber in Paterna (Valencia), is also the world's largest processor of Western red cedar soundboards.
Many of the factories and workshops that make these guitars are in close proximity to Barber. In fact, I'm pretty sure that there are two guitar factories located in the same industrial park as Barber. I know that the Raimundo factory is there and I think there's at least one other.
The bottom line is that Western red cedar, even though it's a North American wood and does not grow in Europe, is cheaper than spruce in Spain.



n85ae -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 13:42:54)

Cedar topped Blanca's sound cool. Different than Spruce. Go to LaFalseta
there's a nice sound clip of a Pedro De Miguel Cedar top.

Jeff



Tom Blackshear -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 17 2008 14:31:29)

The reason I use spruce for flamenco tops is that it is stiffer and can take a thinner top graduation than Cedar. Cedar will normally have to be thicker and this involves a different Key with top tuning. It's not a question of brightness but that of structural and fine-tuning aspects, imo. But the stiffer the fan bracing, the better cedar holds up if it has to be thinner. But then we are back to square one with the tuning procedure. This is one reason I use spruce for flamenco Blanca guitar tops; and then we have the color co-ordination problem with cedar by having to use a deeper or darker color to match the woods. It gets more complicated but these are the basic reasons from my bench. And then there's tradition, which I'm locked into for the duration of my time on this earth.



avimuno -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 21 2008 1:45:22)

Doesn't Manolo Sanlucar uses a cedar top guitar? Is that why his sound is so different from other players?



Anders Eliasson -> RE: Why cedar for student flamenco guitars? (Apr. 21 2008 2:51:11)

Yes he does. On a Negra. His sound comes from his instrument and he´s way of playing. Super controlled.

I find Cedar to be a wonderfull top wood for Negras, especially if you look for a different and powerfull Solo guitar sound. This is my favorite so far. Its in Canada: http://www.eliassonguitars.com/coral.htm



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