Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Full Version)

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Arash -> Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 14 2007 14:05:52)

One of my friends wants to start learning flamenco guitar and he needs a good beginner flamenco guitar. He can afford max. 500 Euros and we want to find the best solution for this price range.

Now after comparing prices and reading comments/critics i came to following result:

YAmaha CG171SF
or
Prudencio Saez Model 22

The Yamaha is around 400 Euros and the Saez around 450 Euros here in Germany. Both solid Cypress.
Other guitars were eather expensive or from cheaper woods like Sciromoco.

What are your experiences? Any other (better) guitar in this price range?
And if not, Yamaha or Saez ?



Francisco -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 15 2007 2:57:54)

Well, the answer's obvious, isn't it? You always go with the more expensive choice, it's always better![;)]

Seriously tho, I think it's going to a gamble either way. I have an 171sf. I never did like the tone all that much, and feel is ok. I'd say buy a used yamaha, you can find them on ebay for under $300.



JasonMcGuire -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 15 2007 9:01:39)

I think the Yamaha guitar is fine. You can't expect a lot of tone out of any guitar in that price range. I have 4 or 5 students who have the Yamaha. They sound okay, but more importantly are comfortable to play. I bought one just because the price was so rediculously low, but I sold it to a student that had a phobia of going to Guitar Center.[:D]



Arash -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 15 2007 12:34:37)

Thanks!

The prices in Germany for the Yamahas are higher than in US.

I found it in US new for 350$ (about 300 Euros).
In Germany a new Yamaha costs 400 Euros minimum.

But there is one Yamaha on german ebay at the moment for 330 Euros.

I will tell my friend to bid.



Malo -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 20 2007 19:35:11)

Hallo Arash,
nun kannst du dich entscheiden.

http://cgi.ebay.de/Flamenco-Gitarre-Yamaha-CG-171-oder-Prudencio-Mod-22_W0QQitemZ280126530687QQihZ018QQcategoryZ148662QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Gruß
Bernd



Arash -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 20 2007 21:17:50)

LOL....was für ein Zufall!
Bist du der Verkäufer?

I will call my friend and tell him about this offer!



Malo -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 20 2007 22:01:27)

Nein, ich bin der Malo vom mundo-flamenco forum.

Ich will dir nur helfen.

Ich habe bei dem Verkäufer Flamenco CD´s gekauft. Der ist in Ordnung.

Also nochmals viel Erfolg.

Übrigens, ich komme aus der Nähe von Stuttgart.

Gruß
Bernd



Arash -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 20 2007 22:13:51)

ahhhhh Grüß dich Malo! Jetzt weiss ich Bescheid!
Und Danke für den Tip!!



JBASHORUN -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 20 2007 22:42:32)

Yeah, the Yamaha is good. but only for the price. its obviously no Conde.

Jb



mkhn -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 28 2007 0:50:38)

I think its a good choice to start with the Yamaha. I use it as my "roadie" where I can casually bring to friends' homes or to bbq's and play and let others play it also. If he is a beginner than I think the tone will suffice. Save money for a guitar that will be leagues better once your friend gets a good foundation. I actually had the bone sanded down to bring the action closer and its been a good, reliable guitar. If I play on the Yamaha for a few days and then switch to my Conde, I have to put ear plugs on ;) So yes, the tone can't compare with more established maker's, but for beginner's I dont think you can go wrong.



wiseguy493 -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 28 2007 1:17:25)

I would buy one of the lower Cordoba models before buying a Yamaha



JasonMcGuire -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 28 2007 6:51:16)

I played a student's Yamaha this morning. Easy to play, sounded very flamenco and considering the price...........Save the money for a really killer guitar down the road. In the beginning you just need something that will "work" and won't kill your hands. I wish Yamaha had something like that when I started out.



Arash -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 28 2007 12:36:24)

My friend bought a Yamaha (i bought it for him from ebay) for 300 Euros.
It will be sent to my address so i will have the opportunity to try it out first [;)]

I found many good reviews in internet about this guitar. Some say that it would be better to lower the action a little bit. Lets see if it is really necessary or if the setup is good already.



n85ae -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jun. 28 2007 14:59:04)

I have a Yamaha, and a Pedro De Miguel. I play the Yamaha every day, it sounds
and plays great, and I don't worry about the kids banging on it. After they go to
bed I get out the good guitar. The Yamaha, is a great guitar for the money, and
after this one gets destroyed, I'll buy another.

It's clearly not as good as a "real" flamenco guitar, but if you play it by itself
it certainly sounds fine. I have a Guitar Center nearby, and the Yamaha on the
rack there, out plays every single Cordoba they have.

Put a bone saddle on it, set the string height where you like it, put some good
strings on it, and beat the hell out of it.

$350 is cheap. What's the decision?????? :)



Jim Opfer -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (Jul. 1 2007 17:49:22)

Jason,

What guitar do you play?



GuitarVlog -> RE: Yamaha CG171SF or Saez 22 ?? (May 26 2010 17:23:33)

This is an old topic from 2007 but I thought it's worth it to chime in with some recent experience after doing a head-to-head comparison. The information here will be useful for those who are considering these guitars.

I had the opportunity today to set-up a Prudencio Saez 24 and a Lucida 797 (aka Prudencio Saez 22) for a friend. The Lucida sells for about $800 new if you can find it. The Prudencio Saez sells for about $1000 new. He acquired both used. Both guitars were 5 years old from their date of purchase.

The work included swapping out the nuts and saddles with bone, cleaning, polishing, and action adjustment. The original nuts and saddles seemed to be Tusq. I think the Saez had a bone saddle but I replaced it anyway. I then strung-up both with Oasis GPX normal tension carbons.

It was immediately obvious that the Saez and the Lucida were built in the ways I understand flamencas should be: with lower bridges, slightly thinner bodies, and flatter neck angles. Both also have the typical Spanish heel contruction. In contrast, my Yamaha CG171SF is a classico blanco with a classical guitar's depth, a slightly lower (but not flamenco low) bridge, and a neck block.

What I found most interesting was the the tonal difference versus my Yamaha which also has carbon strings and an upgraded bone saddle. The Lucida and the Saez were better but not by much despite having all-solid wood construction.

I would be inclined to pay more for either of these guitars but not at the prices they are offering them here in the US. If either can be found used and in near mint condition, I would consider $450 to $500 to be fair.

Of course, many of us know that Francisco Navarro's student guitars can be had for $700 to $800 and those are not too far off. My opinion as of today would be to get the Yamaha if you're on a very tight budget or the Navarro if you can spend more. But don't pay $800-$1000 for a new Saez or Lucida.

The price spread in Europe seems notably smaller (as mentioned in the original 2007 post, 400 Euros for Yamaha vs 450 Euros for the Saez) so someone there could opt for the Saez.



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