A compas under my belt? (Full Version)

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Zorro02 -> A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 17:37:46)

Hola, I have been studying flamenco guitar for almost 4 years. I remember my tutor at the time saying... "You must learn a buleria... if you can master that you can master anything." Good advice, I'm sure, but I feel I may be spending too much time trying to master this very complex rhythm. Was just curious to hear your views, was my tutor right, or is there a compas that is generally accepted as a " learners" piece?
Thus far I have studied the rhythms of sevilliana, tientos, soliare and of course buleria.



Ricardo -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 19:08:09)

"A buleria"? meaning a complete piece, no. But nothing wrong with learning the basic compas and a few simple falsetas in the beginning. My feeling is rhythm can be just as hard to pick up with something slow as fast. I start off students strumming solea escobilla style, at tempo. Just about everyone can do that if they can change chords fast enough. Bulerias is not much different rhythmically speaking, so totally approachable to beginners IMO. But should you be learning Jucal first? NO.

Ricardo



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 19:18:05)

quote:

But should you be learning Jucal first? NO.


Ricardo,
can you suggest some falsetas that would be appropriate for beginner or 'advanced beginner'...
Moraito?

Matic



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 19:23:43)

Or, if I say differently... how do your students progress with falsetas? specifically if possible,thanks

Matic



n85ae -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 19:42:20)

Oh, you should see the Bulerias FAQ. :)

Oops, there isn't one yet.

Being in a similar boat, I just purchased the Flamenco Guitar Vol II
DVD/Book by Gerhard Graf Martinez. It has a whole bunch of Compas,
and Falsetta stuff for Bulerias. THANKS Jon Boyes for suggesting it.

Tom Whiteley has a website, which has some good stuff as well. Look
all the way at the bottom of the page, there are some zip files you can
download.

http://home.comcast.net/~flamencoguitar/handbooks.html



Ricardo -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:02:18)

quote:

Or, if I say differently... how do your students progress with falsetas? specifically if possible,thanks

Matic


Well, you are asking me to teach you then, just like my students. I can't really do that verbally on the forum. Even if I tried, how is that fair to my paying students? I have some video lessons over at FT (flamenco-teacher.com). Sorry for the self advertising.

Otherwise you can take my free advice, and pick out some short falsetas that are pretty straight forward compas wise, and master them slow, one at a time. Something that you can physically or technically handle. Not Tomatito. Not modern Paco. There are some old Paco things that are not so bad for students of any level. Of course digging further back to Sabicas, Morao, Parrilla, Niño Ricardo, etc. It is not all easy just because it is old. You have to pick the right things, both doable and inspiring.

To be honest, a lot of the things I teach beginners are very old traditional things I learned from Gerardo Nuñez. They really work, but are they his falsetas? Partly, but a lot from Javier Molina, M. de Huelva, Parrilla etc. I show some snipits of Moraito, but again I would not say just any of his material is "easy". Everyone, even Vicente has SOMETHING easy to play in their rep.

Ricardo



Doitsujin -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:17:09)

Whats the most important thing to learn in flamenco?.. Its playing with feelings. If you just play one note,.. you have to play it with feeling. Not important which palo. Just play an F als exercise. Master that at first. Buleria should be the last you master coz its most difficult.



Ron.M -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:25:21)

quote:

You must learn a buleria... if you can master that you can master anything


Nonsense IMO, Zorro,
I think your teacher is self-deluded into thinking that by knowing probably the most difficult rhythm in Flamenco, that somehow every other form,will fall into place easily.
(And "knowing" and "being able to play" or "truly comfortable with" are VERY different things!)
That's like saying "roughly understand, by rote, a couple of equations from string theory and every other form of mathematics will be a piece of cake".

Everybody keeps looking for a "key" that will unlock everything and suddenly make the whole landscape of Flamenco crystal clear.

It honestly doesn't work that way.

There is no "key".

If you are interested in say, Soleares...then listen to heaps of Soleares sung and played by as many interpreters as you can and try to find the common generic element.

Do that with all the palos.

There is no "King" palo, that will make you understand them all.

cheers,

Ron



Jon Boyes -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:45:20)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Matic
can you suggest some falsetas that would be appropriate for beginner or 'advanced beginner'...
Moraito?


You must be kidding!

Moraito's stuff might be on paper more playable than, say Tomatito or PDL but there is no way this is beginner's material.



Jon Boyes -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:48:09)

quote:

ORIGINAL: n85ae
Being in a similar boat, I just purchased the Flamenco Guitar Vol II
DVD/Book by Gerhard Graf Martinez. It has a whole bunch of Compas,
and Falsetta stuff for Bulerias. THANKS Jon Boyes for suggesting it.


You're welcome , good isn't it? Bulerias via the building blocks of small compas 'chunks', the best way, IMO.



Guest -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:52:40)

yes, i found moraitos material far from easy, its deceptive. It sounds easy or somewhat simple, but it isnt.



Doitsujin -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:56:57)

Well... As I said. Its not easy to play with feeling. Moraitos compositions arent very advanced. But his playing grooves. Thats it.



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 20:59:57)

Thanks n85ae! And Jon!

Thanks to you Ricardo.
I didn't ask because i'd want to be unfair to your paying students or to you.
I hope you understand my situation. There's one serious flamenco player in my
country. Unfortunately he's 150 km away from me, besides that he doesnt teach.
Sadly, theres one friend of mine who would be interested in playing a cajon with
me. but he's busy all the time. Noone in my family really likes flamenco. My dad tells
me its awful. This is sometimes a little hard to get over as a 17-year-old. But who
cares. Flamenco gives me more than any other thing could.
Im just happy if someone gives me some support from time to time.
I have never took any flamenco lesson from anybody except from you guys and
girls on this forum. Thanks god for it.
And I didnt know that your students have to pay you to tell them which falsetas
they should learn. If this is what one pays to a teacher, well, maybe i dont need
one.

Dont get me wrong, Ricardo, you've already helped and inspired me more than
anyone here. I just sometimes dont understand the capitalistic way of our lives and
world. Maybe I'm again too young and naive.

Thanks anyway.

Matic



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:03:21)

quote:

You must be kidding!


Yes.

I just read once on the foro that Moraito is easy. It seemed hillarious for me.



koella -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:08:01)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Matic
Dont get me wrong, Ricardo, you've already helped and inspired me more than
anyone here. I just sometimes dont understand the capitalistic way of our lives and
world. Maybe I'm again too young and naive.

Matic


That's not fair Matic.
[:D]
Yes you are young and naive. And most important. You don't have to pay the bills.[;)]



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:14:04)

Oh, really[:)]

Not bills, but I started saving for a new pair of shoes so Doitsujin wll be happy.[;)]

Anyway, Koella, bills are really putting your back up, dont they?



koella -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:16:15)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Matic
Anyway, Koella, bills are really putting your back up, dont they?


Uhm, I don't know what you mean by that ?



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:19:48)

Oops... We just took 'idioms' at English[:)]

And it (put someones back up) is supposed to mean 'make angry, upset' .

Dont know if its correct.
[:)]

Well, what about stopping offtopicing?[;)]



koella -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:24:45)

No Matic.
I Understand the expression. But why are you addressing it to me ?

Off topic or not, you have to explain, I'm curious.


[8|]



koella -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:30:58)

And btw. No 17 year old kid from Slovenia is going to hold me back from being off topic.[8D]

I don't even know what the topic is.



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:34:17)

Hahaha

No, I just got that impression by reading some posts of yours where you mention bills and how that is one of the worst things of being an adult. My impression may be wrong.
But I agree, it is a dissadvantage.[;)][:)]

Capitalism is still bad[:'(]



Mark2 -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:35:49)

That's cause your sauced on that wine!!



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:37:09)

How do you know I'm a 17 year old kid from Slovenia?

I could be a fat stinky grandmum with one tooth and 3 tits. Dont be NAIVE, koella![X(]



Zorro02 -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:37:45)

What has happened? genuine question, some really good responses, some really useless. I expect better from respected members, you know who you are!!!!



koella -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:48:49)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Matic
No, I just got that impression by reading some posts of yours where you mention bills and how that is one of the worst things of being an adult. My impression may be wrong.
But I agree, it is a dissadvantage.[;)][:)]


Hm,You must confuse me with somebody else. I have no problems with paying the bills. Had one today for 4 window frames in the garden house. No problem !



koella -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:50:28)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorro02

What has happened? genuine question, some really good responses, some really useless. I expect better from respected members, you know who you are!!!!


respected foromembers ? Respected by who ? By other WOWOWOOOOOH..."respected"foromembers ???[:D]



Mark2 -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 21:53:50)

OK Zorro,
I'll be serious. I think after four years you should have been exposed to a lot more of flamenco than you have. Four years is enough time to cover the basics in alegrias, bulerias, solea, sig, fandangos, tango, sevillanas, in other words, all the main palos and more like farruca, garrotin, tientos, etc.

But, you didn't say how long you stayed with the teacher. If you stayed six months and left, well, you got six months worth of his knowledge. If you have been taking a lesson every week for four years, you should perhaps look at trying another teacher. Flamenco is a very deep art, and most people who are serious about learning it will study for years with various teachers. If possible, maybe check out another teacher. The internet is great, but it's not enough, IMO. Face to face is how it's always been done. That way the teacher can see and hear what you are doing and guide you.



koella -> [Deleted] (Apr. 19 2007 22:00:57)

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Apr. 19 2007 22:04:01



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 22:01:34)

quote:

You must confuse me with somebody else. I have no problems with paying the bills.


aha...then sorry.[;)][:)]



Matic -> RE: A compas under my belt? (Apr. 19 2007 22:04:31)

quote:

Of course I knew you were a fat stinky grandmum, but I just wanted to play your little game of photo-from-an-innocent-17-year-old-nerd


Bwajajajaaa...

fat stinky grandmum with one tooth and 3 tits ... from holland. [sm=lol.gif]
Dont play with me!



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