My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981

My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Full Version)

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Ricardo -> My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 15 2025 16:25:46)
We saw some black and white clips of this show years ago, but the full concert in color is very inspiring for me. Why do I like this one so much? 1. Paco makes TONS of mistakes. Even Ramon and he are laughing at all the mess. In a way I find it endearing and inspiring for some reason as the concert is still enjoyable with all the errors. He even has to improvise a lot of variations to get out of trouble. 2. I always loved that guitar that he used briefly. The sound from Friday/Saturday in San francisco and later Solo Quiero Caminar and Castro Marin that this instrument was used on I enjoyed. It has a very dry percussive mid range sound that makes the treble notes pop out. Also the look of it, the Rosette really pops out for some reason. Also I have clocked his runs over the years and he always pushed past the normal range using this guitar for some reason. Even in this video we can see that Rio ancho at 105bpm, wow. Anyway, this negra unlike his others has a very dry blanca sound to my ears. He admitted it was not his "best guitar" which was stolen in 79 or 80, so perhaps he was upset even playing this thing as a 2nd tier guitar. He never pulled it out again in public after replacing it with his main guitar in 1982. 3. The repertoire is a great mix of old and new material. 4. It has been a long time since I was inspired by guitar concert. Nobody new is really doing it for me like this guy did. Flamenco I listen to years now is only old cante. 5.Paco has a beard. He said his family thought he was disrespectful doing this so it is rare to see until they had passed away and he started wearing a beard on stage in the mid 2000s til his death. 6. The sound is uncompressed and natural, the guitar sounds like mine when I play in the living room. The video shots of close up technique are great, you can even see the detail in the cejilla.

edguerin -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 15 2025 17:32:37)
Great material!!!! Reminded me of why I admired Paco and fell in love with flamenco. BTW 1983? 1981?

Arash -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 15 2025 18:12:12)
wow never seen this one before, watching it right now and enjoying it soooo much with a glas of red wine. Great find !! Paco was always ahead of his time. Even with the beard! Nowadays it's almost disrespectful to not have a beard

kitarist -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 15 2025 18:21:26)
quote: ORIGINAL: edguerin Great material!!!! Reminded me of why I admired Paco and fell in love with flamenco. BTW 1983? 1981? Yeah, saw that too. I figure 1981 Liege is when the concert actually happened, and the 1983 reference is the year when it was shown on RTBF (la radio-télévision belge de la Fédération Wallonie-Bruxelles) It is a great find, very inspiring! (got something in my eye... BRB)

Filip -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 16 2025 18:44:35)
Fantastic!

silddx -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 16 2025 20:00:49)
I don't listen to Paco much, but enjoying this very much so far, thank you.

devilhand -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 17 2025 18:44:16)
quote: Paco makes TONS of mistakes. Mistakes only during picado? This goes to show picado is the most difficult technique. Now we all agree on this. Can anyone see what kind of abanico Paco uses at 1:30? After slowing it down, I see p up, am down and i down. That's why it sounds as strong as pmp.

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 18 2025 7:02:31)
he messes up every technique at some point in this, it is really great! But mostly his left hand in wrong fret, forgetting what he is doing, etc. He was probably mad at one little screw up after the first piece and couldn't get out of the funk. pretty sure that rasgueado is i down, p up, a down, i down, p up.

Arash -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 18 2025 10:18:08)
Is that a fret marker on side of the neck at 7th fret?? Maybe that threw him off with all the capo position changes [:D] 1st, then 3rd, then 2nd, then no capo, then 2nd ..... Fret dots would visually unconciously f. you up a bit in flamenco, since we use capo so much imo. Then again, it's Paco and he can play all these pieces blind, so hmm maybe not and I'm just tripping and he just was a bit hungover[8D] But I have to admit, I was surprised to see that on Paco's guitar. Never even noticed this

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 18 2025 11:37:53)
quote: But I have to admit, I was surprised to see that on Paco's guitar. Never even noticed this Any over the shoulder shots reveal this. First time I noticed was the Concerto de Aranjuez, which was a different guitar. He puts that on deliberately, looks like a blob of white nail polish or paint. Those angles also revealed the picado movement from the big knuckle very clearly, rather than the middle finger joint (a fun argument over the years on foro thanks to Graf Martinez method etc.).

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 20 2025 15:11:24)
This is a question for luthiers actually, also seen in the San Francisco video when light shines into the soundhole, this guitar has a bizarre diagonal brace on the back. I read in the archives about a weird "floating back brace", however, on a Conde or similar flamenco negra I have not ever seen this thing. Could this be a repair (weird at that angle) or an actual structural design? seen at 21:41, to the left of the cross made by the harmonic bar and the center strip Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Echi -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 20 2025 15:21:41)
It has to be a repair or anyway a strut added occasionally to support a weak spot of the back. I never saw that feature in any other Conde of that epoch nor I think it may improve the tone of a guitar but to address wolf tone issues. The rosette was quite common for the time.

Arash -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 20 2025 15:34:31)
From the foto It looks thinner than a brace, more like some sort of crack cleat, like the white ones here https://proluthiertools.com/product/top-and-back-crack-repair-cleats/?v=a672068055fa Maybe a long crack?

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 20 2025 15:40:41)
Right. It just seems bizarre to run against the grain that way, usually those work in the direction of the grain lines.

Arash -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 20 2025 15:55:09)
A possibility could also be some sort of very light stick which was needed to reach a certain position on side of guitar from inside through the hole and repair , like something shown in this video, but still weird

devilhand -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 24 2025 11:57:29)
quote: pretty sure that rasgueado is i down, p up, a down, i down, p up. I read on the foro pai is normally associated with Paco because Paco made it popular. I don't know if it's true. Maybe Paco used it first?

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 24 2025 15:39:39)
quote: ORIGINAL: devilhand quote: pretty sure that rasgueado is i down, p up, a down, i down, p up. I read on the foro pai is normally associated with Paco because Paco made it popular. I don't know if it's true. Maybe Paco used it first? No, but he rarely did the marote thing, I think I saw him do that only twice. Tomatito used both and his instructional video was one of the first visual references I ever had to learn from. Vicente Amigo also used it. Later I was surprised Nuñez, like Paco, avoided it and used P-a-i mainly. It took a long time to develop it since marote was easier and very effective. Only now days have I replaced it in like 80% of cases. Pai goes back to Montoya and likely earlier. Origins are murky, but it probably started as the gallop as we also use the iai, so p replaced the up stroke. That is what I suspect at least. The old "graneado doble" of the Marin method for example, uses the thumb to make a connected roll.

silddx -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 24 2025 16:46:56)
quote: Is that a fret marker on side of the neck at 7th fret?? My tutor has a little blob of BluTack on the 7th.

devilhand -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 26 2025 7:31:37)
quote: Origins are murky, but it probably started as the gallop as we also use the iai, so p replaced the up stroke. That is what I suspect at least. The old "graneado doble" of the Marin method for example, uses the thumb to make a connected roll. Traced back to the Baroque period? See the last strumming at 0:50. https://m.youtube.com/shorts/RpUCxztdpUg

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 26 2025 15:38:20)
quote: ORIGINAL: devilhand quote: Origins are murky, but it probably started as the gallop as we also use the iai, so p replaced the up stroke. That is what I suspect at least. The old "graneado doble" of the Marin method for example, uses the thumb to make a connected roll. Traced back to the Baroque period? See the last strumming at 0:50. https://m.youtube.com/shorts/RpUCxztdpUg Would be interesting to see the source of that info. I have an old dissertation and the types are mentioned I will re-check. He called "abanico" wrongly, that was the last triplets he showed, but someone called the normal fingers roll "abanico" or he thinks of it that way for some reason, but in flamenco lexicon pai and other wrist movements are "abanico". But this guy is influenced by modern tech in that regard (he is using modern flamenco tech for his baroque guitar strum). Considering the Baroque strum is NOT in the Marin method nor other treatises from the 19th century (at least of the ones Romerito and I discussed recently in Grandaddy thread), it might not be relevant to Spain. Battuto sounds Italian. EDIT: Italian guitar music 1606-37, "trillo and repico=rasgueado" a lot done by only index up and down. Sometimes thumb and index together, it was not clear if they work down up or separated, as examples musically were not clear. Foscarini has trilling described with thumb down and up and middle, which is essentially the "marote" in my mind. "Repicco" described by Foriano Pico says m down, p down, p up, index up, like that Batutto thing showed above. Foscarini repicos sound like gallops I described earlier, either fingers down like triplet flams or fingers and thumb down (no return strokes). Then a third example that even I can't decipher (m down, P up?, I down, m up I up?). An earlier source "Marsenne" seems to indicate thumb and index, like a marote type thing as well. So, some sort of basic strumming going on but hard to tell without videos or clear notation what they mean.

hamia -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 29 2025 11:22:43)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ricardo Those angles also revealed the picado movement from the big knuckle very clearly, rather than the middle finger joint (a fun argument over the years on foro thanks to Graf Martinez method etc.). Objection! They reveal nothing of the sort. And the middle knuckle picado is alive and kicking - I can report significant progress. One day I'm going to have to post a video. My issue is that I always play my thin silent travel guitar while I am in front of my PC. So I need time to get used to a wide body normal guitar. I'll dust of my Canin negra or Green blanca one of these days - they've barely been played. One tip for picado enthusiasts: look up Grisha's youtube vid where he shows two picado/scale exercises - they are gold.

orsonw -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 29 2025 12:06:06)
quote: I can report significant progress. One day I'm going to have to post a video. My issue is that I always play my thin silent travel guitar while I am in front of my PC. Please do post a video. You can record on your silent guitar now. It will still be audible if you don't have the metronome too loud.

devilhand -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 29 2025 14:01:27)
quote: And the middle knuckle picado is alive and kicking I play big knuckle picado. My tip and middle joint are fully relaxed. What drives the whole movement is the big knuckle so that my fingers can push the strings down to the soundboard. It's the basic movement of apoyando. At 0:24 Graf Martinez plays big knuckle picado. If he had relaxed his i and m fingers fully, his picado would have been much better.

Ricardo -> RE: My new Favorite Paco concert, 1981 (Nov. 29 2025 16:34:00)
quote: Objection! They reveal nothing of the sort. And the middle knuckle picado is alive and kicking oh here we go again![:D] I object to the objection. And Graf Martinez, who also thought like you seems to have changed is mind after much discussion of that issue.

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