no numbers (Full Version)

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rafapak -> no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 1:52:11)

lets say that in video below you cant see numbers but you can hear only clapping. can you guess somehow when 12 beats cycle begins ?




kitarist -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 2:07:11)

Yes, for sure. Even without the changes in volume, the clapping patterns for each segment of 3 counts (i.e. during 12-1-2, 3-4-5, 6-7-8, and 9-10-11) are different and not symmetric(*), and the 3-4-5 is the only part where there is 3 singles. As soon as you hear the simple x -x -x you know it is the 3-4-5, then the rest aligns. But there is also the loudness variation, with 12 and 3 being the most emphasized.

(*) pattern-wise, 12-1-2 and 6-7-8 have the same clapping pattern, but 12 is more emphasized than the 6, so you can tell them apart from that or certainly from the fact that after the 12-1-2 come the 3 simples, unlike with after the 6-7-8.



AndresK -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 7:30:45)

If someone has studied flamenco a bit more seriously that just a few youtube videos, he/she can understand many palos without seeing any numbers.



rafapak -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 11:02:31)

what do you have to be able to do if you want to recognise rhythm patterns on the basis of clapping only ?



Norman Paul Kliman -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 11:31:00)

Listen for "1-2-3" and "7-8." There should be something a little different at those points. When you hear one of those cues, start counting in your head and see if it works out.

That's a very slow bulería in the video you posted, more like a fast cantiña (alegría, caracoles, etc.)



devilhand -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 12:14:24)

quote:

can you guess somehow when 12 beats cycle begins ?

A few hints:

- It's easier to follow Bulerias compas when you start to count at 12.
- In general there's more clapping on 6 7 8 9. Can we call them falseta beats?
- Single beats mostly on 12-1-2 and 3-4-5 or 10 11.
- Compas resolves on 10. It can be 12 in Bulerias.
- 11 can be omitted after the resolution on 10.



silddx -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 13:56:55)

This may help a little.




Stu -> RE: no numbers (Dec. 24 2024 22:50:15)

Listen to some flamenco. Then listen to some flamenco, then keep listening and keep listening to some more flamenco. Find a bulerias play list on Spotify and listen on loop.
Same with solea and same with alegrias. Soak it up.

Once you drum that 12 beat cycle into your brain you'll hear it every time. But it takes a while.

It's OK to say listen for certain counts as they have a characteristic sound/feel. But if you are so lost you can't find any of the count numbers, you will just be chasing it all the time.

I recall asking a similar question many years ago.

One day it just clicked.

I found hearing the classic stresses was the key for me.
12..3..6.8.10.
12..3...78.10.

Hearing the repetative pulse
But at speed. Slow didn't work.

Then coming back to a compas track like this you can make sense of that additional claps and clicks.



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