Jeronimo Perez (Full Version)

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Message

Muzweli53 -> Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 21 2023 22:01:17)

Hi,

I'm new to this forum, and have a question. I'm going back and forth over buying a new Perez Madagascar/German (5K) or a 2015 GVR 51 Barbero (4K). I know, I know, two different animals, but I could use some input here. Both would be sent on approval. But I'd sure like to narrow it down to save on return costs.

Jim



bahen -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 22 2023 15:14:56)

Any video presentations available for these guitars?



Filip -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 22 2023 17:24:14)

I am not very familiar with these two guitar so I can't contribute in that aspect.

What I can say is that, IMHO, if you have the chance to try the guitars before buying you should most definitely do it. It has been discussed here many times, the thing is that you need to play a guitar in order to know if it is for you or not, and the maker/model/price does not guarantee you that you will like it more than some other guitar. So, I don't know the price tag of the return costs, but if I were you I would probably pay it in order to make a better informed decision on which guitar to finally buy.



Ricardo -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 22 2023 19:06:22)

For 5K you can get a nice used Conde Hemanos. What is GVR? I assume they used the Barbero 51 plan….I might have played that actual Barbero or one like it at Brune’s years ago. Nice guitar, but the Conde and Reyes were better IMO.



Morante -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 23 2023 16:42:01)

Paco Cepero always played his Faustino Conde (1967?)until it was no longer playable. He did not buy another Conde, but a Jerónimo Perez, which now he plays all the time.



Richard Jernigan -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 23 2023 19:07:22)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo

For 5K you can get a nice used Conde Hemanos. What is GVR? I assume they used the Barbero 51 plan….I might have played that actual Barbero or one like it at Brune’s years ago. Nice guitar, but the Conde and Reyes were better IMO.


GVR = German Vazquez Rubio? I have seen a couple of his " '51 Barbero" models listed on the internet.

I don't think Bruné had Sabicas's guitar when you were at his shop, though he did draw the plan of it published by the Guild of American Luthiers. When I was there we played a Barbero that was one of the ones I liked best, but it wasn't Sabicas's.

Aaron Green had Sabicas's '51 Barbero for a while, either on loan or to sell it. Green says his blancas are strongly influenced by it.

RNJ



Echi -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 25 2023 10:03:55)

Richard is correct.
Now that ‘51 Barbero (for years in Aaron Green shop) went sold by the owner.
I suppose that Barbero and Ramirez kind of guitar are ideal if your ideal standard is the tone of Escudero or Sabicas.
The guitars of Jeronimo are more Conde oriented with a big plantilla.
It really depends on what you are looking for.



bahen -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 25 2023 10:35:57)

quote:

I suppose that Barbero and Ramirez kind of guitar are ideal if your ideal standard is the tone of Escudero or Sabicas.
The guitars of Jeronimo are more Conde oriented with a big plantilla.


Curious as to what the mentioned tonal differences are between those guitars.



Ricardo -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 25 2023 11:45:15)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Echi

I suppose that Barbero and Ramirez kind of guitar are ideal if your ideal standard is the tone of Escudero or ….





Ricardo -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 25 2023 13:36:17)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Morante

Paco Cepero always played his Faustino Conde (1967?)until it was no longer playable. He did not buy another Conde, but a Jerónimo Perez, which now he plays all the time.




this guitar has nice snappy basses. Trebles? Hmmm….




mt1007 -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 25 2023 19:53:39)

Hello Jim,

If your only two options are the Perez and GVR, I would go with the Perez. He is doing well and in demand in Spain. If you're looking for the Conde sound, plantilla etc Check out Jose Salinas. His new builds are based off the 60's and 70's Condes. I've played several of his guitars and yeah, they are legit. El Amir plays them, you can find some on Reverb dot com and Mundo Flamenco etc... I dont know if Solera Flamenca is carrying his guitars yet but I'm sure they will.

All the best man!!



JasonM -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 25 2023 21:30:28)

quote:

The guitars of Jeronimo are more Conde oriented with a big plantilla


How much larger is a Conde plantilla roughly? Compared to average …



Richard Jernigan -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 26 2023 1:27:29)

At the end (3:25) of the video of Escudero playing his bulerias "Impetu," the headstock of his guitar looks to me like a Conde "media luna," but it's not the sharpest video.

At 1:21 on the clip of Cepero playing solo, you can very clearly see the Conde "media luna" headstock, with the initials P C on it. But his guitar also has the initials M C on the upper bout of the soundboard. Mariano Conde?

Accompanying Serrano, Cepero is definitely playing a Jerónimo Perez.

RNJ



orsonw -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 26 2023 9:56:16)

quote:

At the end (3:25) of the video of Escudero playing his bulerias "Impetu," the headstock of his guitar looks to me like a Conde "media luna,"


Yes it's a Conde. Ricardo was being cryptic with ironic video posting. Showing the 'tone of Escudero' with a Conde. Then Cepero still playing a Conde (Mariano), at least some of time.

Then posting a Jeronimo Perez and commenting on the trebles. That video/audio is not representative in my opinion/experience.
In 2014 I went to Algodonales and commissioned Perez to build a 670 scale blanca. The trebles and basses are very strong and evenly balanced. Describing a guitar sound is a losing game, but here goes. In general I would say my Perez is kind of like a Conde in the way the sound is balanced, and focused without too much overtone. The Perez has more dynamics. It is both stronger more 'macho', and also has a more beautiful/character to the sound.



Ricardo -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 26 2023 13:03:00)

quote:

ORIGINAL: orsonw

quote:

At the end (3:25) of the video of Escudero playing his bulerias "Impetu," the headstock of his guitar looks to me like a Conde "media luna,"


Yes it's a Conde. Ricardo was being cryptic with ironic video posting. Showing the 'tone of Escudero' with a Conde. Then Cepero still playing a Conde (Mariano), at least some of time.

Then posting a Jeronimo Perez and commenting on the trebles. That video/audio is not representative in my opinion/experience.
In 2014 I went to Algodonales and commissioned Perez to build a 670 scale blanca. The trebles and basses are very strong and evenly balanced. Describing a guitar sound is a losing game, but here goes. In general I would say my Perez is kind of like a Conde in the way the sound is balanced, and focused without too much overtone. The Perez has more dynamics. It is both stronger more 'macho', and also has a more beautiful/character to the sound.


Yep you get me. I played at least one Perez and heard some up close…I would love to hear yours. So far, that audio (Cepero) is what I expect. Keep in mind, Cepero is singing LOUDER than Samuel…the mic is no where near his mouth [:D]. The mic is very “real” in other words. Sorry if it sounds critical, maybe la Bella strings would make a difference? Would like to hear yours (just strum some bulerias). You might sell me on it, and the OP too.



Morante -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 26 2023 16:04:16)

I have worked with Jero since the beginning and have played most of his guitars since then. ( He is family). The guitar which most impacted with the family was my Gerundino.

But he is a indepentent thinker. When the Ayuntamiento wanted to cut down the cypress in the cementary, he bought the trees, had them sawed in Ronda and dried in his taller.

Conde have no influence here. Jero is making some of the best guitarras in España.And some of the best tocaores agree.



Echi -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 26 2023 16:28:00)

Escudero played also Conde in his last years, Ricardo is correct. I even saw his guitar restored by Felipe Conde.
In the seventies he used to other guitars though as Reyes, Arcangel a Contreras etc.
When I said the Barbero may better fit a kind of traditional style I referred to that but of course it’s a generalisation.
There are many good young luthiers nowadays and for sure Jeronimo is among them.



crooksj5 -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 26 2023 17:00:18)

Hi Everyone,

My store Wood Vibrations Music is currently the only authorized U.S. dealer for Jeronimo Perez Guitars. His guitars are fantastic, I have personally owned a few and also sell his instruments through my store.



lohan -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 11:17:51)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Morante

Paco Cepero always played his Faustino Conde (1967?)until it was no longer playable. He did not buy another Conde, but a Jerónimo Perez, which now he plays all the time.


Hi Morante,
Did Paco Cepero use the same guitar (Faustino Conde - 1967) with la orquesta de Cordoba for Suite Gades ??




Echi -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 11:23:41)

That is a Conde but it doesn’t look as a ‘67. Probably somewhere in the 70ies



bahen -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 15:18:44)

Is it just me or is Cepero quite sloppy? [&:]



Morante -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 16:07:00)

It´s just you. Cepero is up there with mitos como Melchor.



devilhand -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 16:27:48)

quote:

Is it just me or is Cepero quite sloppy?

He's almost 80 years old. Cepero is a living legend.



Ricardo -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 17:34:23)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bahen

Is it just me or is Cepero quite sloppy? [&:]


Maybe he is, but where exactly? Not seeing any bad notes yet, but it is a long video. There are literally zero 80 year old players as fast and accurate as him. His music was never as complex on the left hand as PDL, however, his aggressive right hand style has always been on point…and for accompanying cante, his dynamics and sensitivity is the best of all time maybe. The models have been Ramon Montoya, Melchor and Ricardo, Cepero, and finally Moraito. No one has done a better job than those 5, and of them, I consider Cepero the best.



bahen -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 29 2023 22:49:28)

quote:

Maybe he is, but where exactly? Not seeing any bad notes yet, but it is a long video. There are literally zero 80 year old players as fast and accurate as him.


I had forgotten about his age (though the video is from 10 years ago). I'm reminded of that Churchill quote that said something along the lines of 'keep your words tender in case you need to eat them.' I'm eating my words :)

(But, just for fun, I found the the picado run at 10m05s not particularly clean; there's also a bad note somewhere around 11m15s–25s; something else goes badly at 11m34s; etc etc. It's probably the recording rather than Cepero.)



lohan -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 30 2023 13:07:02)

quote:



(But, just for fun, I found the the picado run at 10m05s not particularly clean; there's also a bad note somewhere around 11m15s–25s; something else goes badly at 11m34s; etc etc. It's probably the recording rather than Cepero.)


Hello

Paco de lucia said: "I prefer to hear an imperfect note than lose the rhythmic flow"

Source: Page 78 - Flamenco - All You Wanted to Know By Emma Martinez



devilhand -> RE: Jeronimo Perez (Jan. 30 2023 19:56:04)

quote:

ORIGINAL: lohan

quote:



(But, just for fun, I found the the picado run at 10m05s not particularly clean; there's also a bad note somewhere around 11m15s–25s; something else goes badly at 11m34s; etc etc. It's probably the recording rather than Cepero.)


Hello

Paco de lucia said: "I prefer to hear an imperfect note than lose the rhythmic flow"

Yep, that's the exact opposite of what classical guitar players advocate. I heard classical guitar players are crazy about getting THE right tone. It goes to show again classical and flamenco guitar playing are different animals.



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