Index finger right hand (Full Version)

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Fluknu -> Index finger right hand (Oct. 31 2022 8:07:14)

I'm starting to think I have a problem with my index finger from the right hand (I'm right handed).
Here's my problem:
1. when doing arpeggios, pima, pami or pimami, M & A have the good moove:they go towards the palm as it should be. But the index is like pinching away from the palm. This really slows me down in fast arpeggios like in Solea or Solea por Buleria. I'm enhancing the problem, so you can understand, but the sensorimotor problem is actually very subtle. But it's there.
2. Then I noticed that in the Rasgueado amii amii, like in Alegria for example, the ami is rythmically ok, but when the index is going up at the end for the second run of amii, it's slightly out of beat.
3. Then I also noticed that in the iai iai, rasgueado, when they' have to be fast, like in solea for some fillings in the F and C part, again, the return stroke (up stroke) of the index is out of tempo.

I have no idea if these issues are connected, but I'm starting to point the finger at my...pointing finger....the index. I've never had any injury on that finger or on that hand.

Any idea?

orsonw -> RE: Index finger right hand (Oct. 31 2022 9:59:32)

Has your index always been doing this, or is it something that has only just started happening? It sounds like you are saying that your index finger has some slight muscle activation taking it into extension, at a time when it should be flexing? Can you post a video to be clear?

Are all three problems actually the same. For 2. and 3. is it that you need to work on rhythm rather than there being any neuromusculoskeletal 'problem' with your index?

For problem 1. this may also just be a bad habit not a neuromusculoskeletal 'problem'. It can take some exploration to find out exactly what is going on. For example it may be that there is some tension somewhere else that your index is reacting to. There could be more than one reason for this. For example in my case the index had a tendency to do this in double arpeggios, for me it is the M/A/M transition that caused the tension that then manifest as index extension when playing above 90bpm. This is improving, but taking a long time!

But every person is different so I would recommend having a one to one consultation with an experienced teacher to explore this with you in detail.

Ricardo -> RE: Index finger right hand (Oct. 31 2022 13:41:26)

1. Try planting each finger. Like the way Scott Tennant shows the Pami tremolo, where each finger comes down and stops the string before playing. That really helps tremolo and the arpegio pattern giving you problems is the same one. But you have to plant the fingers before each stroke, so go very slow at first and gradually speed up. Eventually, with tons of repetions, your index will instinctively get down into the plant position when you start playing fast. 1:48:00

2. This is the general problem for every single student. The fix is the triplet to beat pattern i up ami down so it is a galloping triplet. So iam i….iam i. When learning this and executing DO NOT BEND AND FLICK FROM THE THUMB. Keep the fingers free and relaxed, only stiffing them slightly as they move across the strings. Here is a video at 2:50:

This basic strum for Fandango Tangos etc sets up the continuous roll that can start on any stroke.

3. The same concept applies to the iai as the above, which is the same minus the middle finger. Again, af first, don’t bend and flick from the thumb. After you have a smooth and fast pattern as I am demonstrating above, then you can experiment with the bent thumb and flick, and I show it at the end of the same video. It WILL SLOW YOU DOWN. I can not do the patterns from the bent flick position anywhere near as fast as i can do the free finger rolls.

Fluknu -> RE: Index finger right hand (Nov. 2 2022 15:32:00)

Hi guys and many thanks for your insight.

So I digged in and here's what I found. First of all, my index finger always has been behaving like that. With speed coming, I see it blocks me from going further. So I'm working on the good position. Tension indeed. Relaxed it goes way better.

Then for arpeggios I tried the Tenant (staccato) method for tremolo. I added the fifth note to do the flamenco tremolo. It's amazing how it works well to correct the posture.

In the end, the problem with arpegigios and rasgueado is probably not connected.

As I've started to work on fandangos a month ago, I have to admit I had already seen your video, Ricard :) Good help. I'm always flicking and I'm trying now to experiment without.

Work in progress.

Many thanks

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