El niño Miguel (Full Version)

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Tenshu -> El niño Miguel (Mar. 3 2006 15:21:48)

Earlier:


Now:


Time flies.

What happened to this guy? I think he only made one recording. He played like a monster. What happened to him after that recording? I'm guessing drugs (or, judging from this pic, alcohol):



So what happened???

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Guest -> RE: El niño Miguel (Mar. 3 2006 16:27:53)

I cant say exactly what happened to Miguel, but from what I´ve been told you´re probably right. And to this you can add years of playing in the streets. Miguel now has long silver hair, no teeth and dirty clothes.

I saw and heard niño Miguel a few weeks ago in a Peña in Huelva. He played a 2 set gig. It took me 1 palo to get used to his playing and actually hear him instead of feeling overwhelmed. His guitar (very cheap laminated sides and back) sounded like ****. He´s got no nails, giving this rude pflump sound, he is agressive and dirty playing and what he plays is extremely difficult. Lots of old Paco stuff and other things I didn´t recognize. maybe his own things.
When I got through that, I really enjoyed the show. His attitude is very direct in your face, almost punk. What I enjoyed was that there´s no doubt that the man plays a lot, that playing is his life. This guy had something to say and it was quite emotional to be there.

There were another guy playing with a singer (good singer), but I cant remember what he played. He was everything correct, tons of tecnique, Conde A25, new strings, black shoes and semi long hair in the neck[:D]...... But..... empty.



Tenshu -> RE: El niño Miguel (Mar. 5 2006 15:12:16)

That's a really cool write-up. Thanks Anders.

Do you, by any chance, know if there's any recorded material of him, other than the one CD I mentioned? Maybe just a short video/audio clip of playing live?



Guest -> RE: El niño Miguel (Mar. 5 2006 18:32:06)

I dont know about more recordings.

When I was in the peña, I thought about saying hello to Miguel, but I did not do so, I´m not very extrovert when it comes to these things, and besides, I think he had already told me his story. It was all here in his music. And that´s why I liked his gig[;)] It was very personal, and I was full of impressions. I was happy when I left the peña.



Tomás Jiménez -> [Deleted] (Mar. 8 2006 21:05:41)

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Mar. 21 2008 0:50:29



JBASHORUN -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 22 2006 17:16:44)

I just received my copy of El Nino Miguel's CD from Flamenco-world:

https://www.flamenco-world.com/tienda/shop.php?&op_shop=news&id_cat=&op_shop=show&id_prod=4162&id_cat=


I have to admit that it is pretty good. There are two albums worth of songs on there, and it only cost 11 Euros! [:)] I had heard that Miguel was, in his prime, considered as PDL's equal. And I can see some similarities between the two, perhaps too similar IMO. although I would say that Paco is a bit better than Miguel. But Miguel's technique is impressive too. The album is mainly solo Flamenco guitar in the traditional style, but with no cante. There are a couple of songs that are slightly jazzed up or that use an orchestra for backing, and these are an aquired taste, but I think they are reasonably good. as is the rest of the album. Its a shame about his current situation, but hopefully he hasn't given up playing altogether.


Jb



TANúñez -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 22 2006 18:35:34)

quote:

What happened to this guy? I think he only made one recording.


I don't know exactly what caused this but I know he spent several years, possibly most of his life in an institution. His career was beginning to take off and then he was gone! Just like that. It breaks my heart because this man was a monster. I'm just glad he is out now and still playing. I'm sure is just a shell of his former self but at least we still have him around.



gerundino63 -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 22 2006 19:44:25)

There is a video from him: Tesoros de la guitarra flamenca



cneberg -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 22 2006 22:48:41)





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TANúñez -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 22 2006 23:31:50)

I gotta say, Niño Miguel was one cool cat back in the day. Elvis is probably the only other man who could pull off sideburns like that!



Exitao -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 2:06:03)

Anders:

You should donate a guitar to him. Then you have bragging rights that a famous and talented Flamenco uses one of your guitars.

But don't raise your prices until after I mange to scrimp and save and buy one from you first.
[;)]

On another thought, it might be nice if someone could video him playing and put him up on youtube for two reasons:
It's living history.
Who knows how it could benefit him...?



Miguel de Maria -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 2:23:48)

Hey, he doesn't need to give away anything. Pretty soon famous and talented guitarists will be getting on his list.



Guest -> [Deleted] (Jun. 23 2006 2:41:27)

[Deleted by Admins]



Exitao -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 2:49:23)

I was half joking. But luthiers do tend to keep one or two of their finer instruments just for the famous guitarist who might pop by some day.


But I was serious about the video thing. I wonder if someone could get an arts council grant to go around and interview and record talented unknown and lost flamencos.
Something similar to Rhy Cooder's Buena Vista Social Club, but without creating the band.



gerundino63 -> [Deleted] (Jun. 23 2006 8:15:09)

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Jun. 23 2006 16:51:11



cneberg -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 9:09:02)

Here you go:

"En El Puente Nicoba"




Doitsujin -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 13:17:44)

So sad what happened to him. He could play on Pacos level of today. That would have been cool.



bernd -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 14:27:49)

Here is Niño Miguel on Youtube:



Miguel de Maria -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 15:01:15)

I like the "Buena Vista Social Club" idea, I just wonder if people like that exist in Spain? Is there a forgotten generation of great players who have fallen by the wayside because of age or changing fashions, yet retained a large portion of their skills? The second issue is do they have charisma and likeability like the soneros. Cuba is full of characters who are charming and probably a little crazy.



JBASHORUN -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 15:45:28)

Guys, I'm guessing that Miguel gets money for every CD of his work that sells. Maybe the best way to show support and appreciation is to buy his CD.



Jb



TANúñez -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 16:14:50)

quote:

The guy will sell everyting what he can get for boos or drope.


Is this a FACT or assumtion? Maybe Estella could give her two Euros here. I believe she's met him or knows him and may probably know exactly what his deal is.



XXX -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 16:23:29)

Guys I dont know what your intention is to discuss this, but I find it a bit strange to talk about the possible alcohol problems so openly in public. Its a private thing, AND he is not a celebrity, so maybe he wouldnt want it to be discussed here?



gerundino63 -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 16:50:33)

This is a assumtion.

Maybe not wise to post on the internet.

Thanks for making me think better, will delead my post.

Peter



Exitao -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 17:14:23)

quote:

I like the "Buena Vista Social Club" idea, I just wonder if people like that exist in Spain? Is there a forgotten generation of great players who have fallen by the wayside because of age or changing fashions, yet retained a large portion of their skills? The second issue is do they have charisma and likeability like the soneros. Cuba is full of characters who are charming and probably a little crazy.


My conceptualisation would not only include those who are/were famous, but the kind of people who are great players of little fame. The kind that have lived the flamenco life.

Everyone keeps going on about PDL this, PDL that, and everyone has to admit he's a great guitar player. But there must be some very accmplished flamencos out there who are only known within a small community. Players who may not bring virtuouso skills to their music but make up for it with authenticity.
(Which is not to say that PDL is not authentic, but I'd venture to say he's not representative of the community.)

Lately it has become a thing for historians to find people who have lived through certain experiences, or eras, to video interview these people. They call these people 'living history.' Historians are plagued by the fact that they have limited sources of information with which to examine events and this style of documentation is an attempt to over come this.
In fact it seem that with the right people involved in a project like this it could be cross-disciplinary. Arts, history and anthropology. I wonder if the right group could get 3 grants. [8|]



TANúñez -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 17:27:27)

quote:

Guys I dont know what your intention is to discuss this, but I find it a bit strange to talk about the possible alcohol problems so openly in public. Its a private thing, AND he is not a celebrity, so maybe he wouldnt want it to be discussed here?


Well said Deniz. Even celebrities are entitle to keeping their private matters private. Unfortunately, this is rarely the case. Speaking only for myself, I greatly admire Niño Miguel and he is a celebrity to me [:)]



Miguel de Maria -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 18:08:24)

I actually met an American who has made a documentary on some traditional flamencos. I met him at the Cristina Heeren Foundation--he had attended in a previous year and was there to hang out. He had with him a gorgeous young blonde girl who, that year, starred in a TV show. I think it was called "Skin."

Anyway, he was a young guy, and I heard he made a documentary. Unfortunately I can't find any information on him...



nhills -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 19:11:40)

There seems to be a prevalent assumption here that Niño Miguel's problems were alcohol or drugs. From what little information I've found over the years, it was more likely mental illness - possibly schizophrenia (in the days when there were few or no medications available.)

That would explain the institutionalization.

If this is the case, he deserves our sympathy and support, rather than the brickbats some have thrown here.

Cheers,
Norman



Miguel de Maria -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 19:49:52)

Alcohol and drug addiction are genetically based, too. There's just more of an illusion of choice about it.



Exitao -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 21:18:59)

First, I would point out that I have implied nothing about what has happened to El Nino, precisely because I wouldn't want to assume.

When it comes to mental illness and addictions it is certain that there can be a certain level of predisposition for illness or the "addictive personality" but a predisposition is not a cause, it is not a predestination.

There are some mental illnesses for which there are predispositions and when the individual encounters a catalyst mental illness is pretty much certain. E.g. schizophrenia.


But this has nothing to do with flamenco.



koella -> RE: El niño Miguel (Jun. 23 2006 21:53:21)

I say ...( *hic* )..... viva flamenco ! [8D]

[:D]



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