The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Full Version)

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Dudnote -> The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 18 2017 21:15:00)

...definetly not the bouncing - especially if you're a violin. [&:]

Tigger has cracked the tail piece right through the hole which supports the E string's fine tuner.To add insult to injury, Kanga thought a good dose of superglue would solve everything [8|]

Obviously superglue was not going to work. But would any glue be strong enough to hold these thin pieces of wood together given the string pressure? Would a reinforcing piece of wood at the back of the tailpiece be required? Would it give enough strength? Which glue should we be looking to use? Or should we just replace the tail piece?

Thanks
Roo (a.k.a. Dudnita)



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Dudnote -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 18 2017 21:17:51)

Another photo of the break. The E string is completely detuned, so as not to rebreak the piece.



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estebanana -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 19 2017 3:41:07)

Get a new tail piece before the *repair* fails and the ball end of the string puts an eye out.



Dudnote -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 19 2017 4:03:39)

Eye Eye Eyyyyeee!!!!! Eyyyyeeeyyyeeeee!!!!! Eyyyyeeeeeeeeauoooo!!!!!!!!!

Thanks Stephen for pointing that one out.



Anders Eliasson -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 19 2017 7:48:20)

I agree. Its not worth repairing. I know that you are in a part of the world, where buying special things is not always that easy, but I doubt you can get a good result out of repairing. Often these cracks happen because the finetuner "nut" is tightened to much.
If using fine tuners, I personally prefer the synthetic one with built in finetuners. They work a lot better and are easyer on the fingers. They also gives the correct stringlength between the tailpiece and the bridge so that you can fiddle around with tuning that piece of string to mach the playable part of the string by adjusting the length of the length the "string" (what is it called?) that attaches the tailpiece to the endbutton. Its supposed to pitch some octaves above the playablepart of the string (G D A E)
Wheather or not that last finetuning really works, I`m not to sure, because I find it to be darn hard to make all 4 strings tune right at the same time and the pitch changes when you use the finetuners. But at least it gives you something to do on those longer winter evenings where television is showing old swedish crime series that you have already seen at least 1 time before.[;)]
Say hello to yur daughter and keep her playing that violin. Its such a wonderfull instrument to play. Besides playing some reels and jigs and some Jazz, I´m working on Mozart KV304 and Bach Bwv 1004 (not the chaconne. Way to difficult!!!!)



estebanana -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 19 2017 8:51:05)

Tail pieces are not expensive. The one Anders mentioned is brand named Wittner. You can also get good Chinese tail peice on eBay and they ship. But a Wittner is easy to find. Where are you?



Anders Eliasson -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 19 2017 16:14:50)

Yes, Wittner is the name of the one I use myself. The more expensive one can have the strap length adjusted after being installed and with strings on. Rather handy if you want to test the fine tuning I mentioned above.
Besides that, The cheapo Chinese copies that Stephen mention are actually pretty good. They may wear out a bit faster and you cant get spare parts, but price is low and they do the thing they are supposed to do.



Dudnote -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 19 2017 16:24:45)

Many thanks guys for these replies. So reading between the lines, it looks like the tonal advantages of going for wood over plastic or resin are negligible. Now you got me looking, I can't even tell if the broken one is wood or resin - it is very very smooth and looks very similar to the Thomann models which sell for less than 4 dollars. I might have to disect it once we got the replacement.

Naive question. How important is the tuning behind the saddle? Are we talking mainly about the overall resonance of the instrument being more harmonious?



estebanana -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 20 2017 1:04:25)

Get Wittner Model No. 918111

For full size violin. meaning 4/4 size.

Do you know if the violin is full size or 3/4?

http://www.wittner-gmbh.de/saitenhalter_e.html

If you PM me your location I can tell which violin supply shop to order it from.
______________________________________

I recommend the Wittner model I gave the number for because you will not to have to buy any extra crap to mount the tail piece. The Wittner comes with the nylon tail adjuster gut. Get it and the ask Anders or I to advise on how to adjust the tail gut. It's easy.

Don't hassle over the sound or the price, just trust us, this will get you get set up with the least amount of worry. It will sound good. It will be easy to tune up and keep in tune.



estebanana -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 20 2017 1:11:26)

If you are not sure of the size of the violin- here is a chart that shows you how to measure the back of the violin to understand its size.

Each violin size has its own size tail piece.

http://www.fretlessfingerguides.com/measure_violin_body_length.html



Anders Eliasson -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 20 2017 7:25:58)

quote:

Naive question. How important is the tuning behind the saddle? Are we talking mainly about the overall resonance of the instrument being more harmonious?


Its kind of unimportant. many violins are poorly adjusted there. and when using finetuners, its more or less impossible to get right because the stringlength between the bridge and the tailpiece varies when you use the finetuner. But the general idea is that on the short piece between the bridge and the endpiece, the short part below string should tune some octaves (cant remember if its 2 or 3) above the playable staringpart of the above string. Below string could be A together with above string E.
To be honest very few violinist care about this and mine is not totally in tune either because I take the violin out of its case, play it, put it back in its case and go ahead doing something else

The general idea is that the lighter the tailpiece is the better.
Violins are extremely picky instruments. They sound the best without chinrest and shouldrest and even if you move the chinrest 10mm or so, you can hear the difference. All that said, I play with both chinrest and shoulder rest and the chinrest is positioned where I prefer it. Because in the end I have to be able to play it. If not, its not fun.



estebanana -> RE: The most wonderful thing about Tigger is... (Feb. 20 2017 12:34:04)

The strings behind the bridge to the tail piece is called the 'after length'. This is important because if the after length is too short the bridge can be be too tight and not rock back and forth freely. For this reason when you adjust the tail piece location, how far it hangs over the saddle on the bottom edge of the violin is important. In most cases you adjust the tail piece to hang over the back of the violin a few mm. Shortening the tail gut allows the after length to be long and supple and allow the bridge more movement without the counter action of sting tension. This is also why lighter tail pieces are preferred, they allow the bridge to be freer.

It's not so much about after length tuning unless and after length string is vibrating in sympathy with an open or stopped not and causing an overtone problem. Not likely your violin. Cellos have longer string after lengths and is more of a problem, also rare.



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