Music Theory (Full Version)

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TGerman -> Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 15:30:38)

Can anyone recommend beginners book to music theory? Especially as it pertains to flamenco? I would really like to understand more. Also, do you think it is very important to learn theory? I know there are some incredible musicians that no nothing of it.

Thanks everyone,
Todd



Jon Boyes -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 15:46:30)

In a recent post I posted links to several freebie flamenco music theory resources, but for some reason I can't find the post. Never could get the search thing to work properly [&:]

I wouldn't call it 'very important' to learn theory, like you say there are many excellent flamenco guitarists who know little.

However, an understanding of theory is helpful in all music. Most importantly, it gives us a standard language and structure when we need to talk about musical things.



Niklas -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 15:46:31)

Well... I undestand Paco can't read notes and didn't know too much about music theory until he met Di Meola and McLaughlin... But i wouldn't use that as a reason not to learn theory [;)]. (I did untill a few months back [8|]...)

I have also been thinking of getting a book of some sort to learn more but i haven't found a good one yet... So i'm kinda repeating the questiong [:)]

Niklas

WOW!

Jon! You posted 1 second before me [:D][:D]



ToddK -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 15:55:40)

There's a distinction that should be made.

There are those, like Paco, that "know" theory of music, innately.

They cant explain the parts of a chord with theoretical terms,
but , they understand how the system works just as well.
I would say this is fairly rare though.

I say, learn some interval theory. Learn chord construction/progresion.
Nothing heavy. Just the basics can open many doors.
TK



Doitsujin -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 16:49:13)

There is a very good musictheory book for beginners. And its learnable without a teacher. It tells all the absolute basics very simple. The only problem for you would be that I only know it in the german version. The title is: elementare musiklehre ISBN: 3-8024-0348-7 And you need to be able to read notes (the oposite of tab..dont know it in english) Its from the Voggenreiter company. They have many books. You could check their netpage or write them a mail. They will tell you if their bokks are avalible in english. its www.voggenreiter.de
Good luck[;)]



Grisha -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 16:56:57)

In my undergrad I used a book called Tonal Harmony by Stefan Kostka and Dorothy Payne. It's a pretty basic book, but it doesn't talk about flamenco.



XXX -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 18:01:01)

I read somewhere that Paco learned music notation to play Aranjuez.
I can also agree on Doit's recommendation.



carlos soto -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 18:18:26)

I don't know any flamenco oriented theory books, but there's a lot of theory regarding each palo. Go to teoria.com and read the tutorial, then connect what you learn with each palo.
Of course it's not that easy, to get yourself familiar with flamenco you'll need a lot more but that's a good start.



gshaviv -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 20:52:24)

quote:

I don't know any flamenco oriented theory books


This book is perhaps the only music theory book dedicated to flamenco (there's also a version in Spanish). Though its not a "starter" book, meaning it will not teach you music theory if you don't know it, its aimed to those that know classical music theory and it analyzes all flamenco forms in music theory terms and shows how it applies to them.



Miguel de Maria -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 21:02:13)

Wouldn't a "jazz theory for dummies" kind of book work well for this?



Gecko -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 24 2006 22:24:20)

I have found this one to be very helpful, yet not overwhelming.

Mucis Theory Pocket Guide



Ricardo -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 25 2006 16:04:44)

I play flamenco and I know "theory" very well. I can safely say that knowing it will neither harm nor help your flamenco development. I guess in small way, it can harm you if you go in with preconcieved ideas of how flamenco might use or be bound by the same "rules" taught in a theory course. But, if one can still be open minded and put theory aside for awhile when learning flamenco, it is not bad to know. Remember theory is an abstract way of understanding music, just like flamencology. Does not have anything to do with playing, but it CAN be a tool to use if you know how, and don't think in absolutes.

I have a BM in music, and as far as "Tonal harmony" and music theory is concerned, everything you need to know about it is covered by memorizing and understanding this diagram:

http://www.carolinaclassical.com/scales/circle2.jpg

Taking a course is just going through tons of excersises and examples proving why this thing works. Most theory courses skimp on rhythm. I would recomend taking drum lessons or studying rudiments over theory books, especially if you are into flamenco.

One more aspect of music, not tonal harmony or rhythm, but MODAL music. That is eastern music that is based on a drone, where you have scales tuned perfectly, no harmonic movement. The whole point of Tonal music theory (the circle of 5ths) is that you can have moving harmony, changing keys, no drones. Flamenco music is a sort of hybrid of these ideas. The singing is very modal, but the guitar is tonal, or bound to the rules of the Circle of 5ths. So at least for GUITAR study, knowing the circle of 5ths will not hurt.



Miguel de Maria -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 25 2006 16:53:34)

Ricardo, great post. I think I finally just understood what the heck modal means. It's the sound of the cante in bulerias, right?



Ricardo -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 25 2006 17:04:10)

Bulerias, sometimes. C7-F, or the E7 cambio are very tonal ideas the guitar brings to the table, harmonizing tonal progressions to modal singing. Think more about Martinete or Siguiriyas, where it is just going back to A, almost drone like. The best example is El Pele on Canto, where vicente just holds the tonic chord for the whole siguiriya. That is modal.

Ricardo



TGerman -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 25 2006 18:23:45)

Whoa...this is all way above my head. I was just looking for some basic theory to try to get an understanding of what is happening when I play or when I'm told "this is in the key of...".

I actually bought a book which is right up my alley for what I need right now, now don't laugh too hard, "The complete idiots guide to music theory", it provides me with just the right amount of information as it is all totally new concepts to me. This book along with the website Carlos recommended, teoria.com is about as much as I can handle right now. It's all pretty overwhelming.

Thank you all for your suggestions,
Todd



Thomas Whiteley -> RE: Music Theory (Jan. 26 2006 0:15:06)

quote:

Can anyone recommend beginners book to music theory? Especially as it pertains to flamenco?


Todd;

Musical Theory of Flamenco Guitar volumes 1 and 2 by Manuel Granados



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