RE: Please Vote (Full Version)

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gshaviv -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 5:09:39)

I think its an idea with lots of merit (in other words I think its a good idea) but we need to agree on how we manage it if it is to be usefull.

If anyone is familiar with wikipedia.org, its a community based encyclopedia. Anyone can contribute an article, and it has become a great source of information. If anyone can contribute an article, how do you know the article is right? Here comes the power of the community, lots of people are reading the articles and anyone can correct a wrong or out of date articles, so bad articles don't stay up.

That's why I agree with Ron's comments and disagree. Remarks on a video like what guitar was that are useless, but comments on the quality or correctness of the contents are important.

We can try by setting up a members only thread (no posts from guests to prevent clutter) with a sticky thread on top that explains the rules we decide on.

The rules should be something like anyone can start a thread, a thread name has to describe the excersize/falseta demonstrated and the posts in the thread should be restricted to comments about correctness of the material or clarifications for what was demonstrated. We should do threads on excersizes and technique but also threads on falsetas etc. I like ver much the Oscar Herrero Solea and Alegrias DVDs with their structured approach where he demonestrates a bunch of falsetas, llamadas, remates etc. We can do the same as a community and build a larges library of elements from all palos.

Another idea is to use the software wikipedia is using and create a wikimenko site. Heck, we can create something unique here as a musical community. I would gladly contribute some falsetas etc. if we had something like this.



Francisco -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 8:43:53)

I think this is a great idea. Where there is a will, there's a way. I just need to get a good microphone, and I can start contributing. Ok, well maybe I need to get a few more solos under my belt. Ok, really, I just need to really learn how to play the guitar.

I digress....my vote is yes!



Ron.M -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 9:36:23)

quote:

Ron can we do anything about anything now or do we wait for Simon to get back?


Florian,
Wait till Simon gets back.
He's got a lot of experience in project management.
Meanwhile we can discuss what we actually want, before implementing something on an urge then finding 6 months down the road that it's chaotic and unmanageable.

Personally I think search systems are better than sub-forums.
The sub-forum idea would not allow for replies and comments etc without muddying up the system.
The search system IMO would work well provided everyone adhered to the same style of "tagging" in the title...ie.

General Picado Exercise Video or
Bulerias Alzapua Falseta Audio or
Tientos Falseta from Moraito Video.. etc

Then anybody wanting some Picado exercises could enter "Picado Exercise" or somebody wanting to learn some new Alegrias falsetas with Tremolo could enter "Alegrias Falsetas Tremolo" and would be presented with a list of relevant uploads.

What I like about this system is that it does not require any changes to the usual Audio/Video Uploads, but the required material can be easily found.

Going the "sub-catagory" folder way allows "browsing", but becomes overwhelming after time when it runs into 100 pages for each palo and you are really just looking for a particular thing.
It also requires someone to monitor that the material is being filed away properly in the correct folders.

Also, you are assuming that all the teaching material folk have to offer will be good.
People are human...what happens if somebody uploads a Soleares falseta that is out of compás? That hardly makes for good learning material.
Or uploads a Video of a left hand stretching exercise which a lot of experienced players would regard as ill-advised as it could lead to inury?

That's why I think "follow on" comments from other users is important, rather than just a straight video filed under "exercises".

Going through the usual Audio/Video Uploads way allows material to be reviewed by members before it is archived as it just appears in the usual daily posts rather than just quietly added to an ever growing pile of questionable "learning material" in some sub-folder with no comments.

I haven't thought this all the way through yet and the above is only stuff for members to consider.

But personally, I think the least management intensive way to go is for members to agree on an exercise titling format and STICK to it, and then optimize the search engine for that.



cheers

Ron



flyeogh -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 9:44:48)

Ron without Simons incredible efforts and your own dimplomatic efforts then clearly this forum would not be what it is today. But there is also a danger that without change it will stagnate.

I for one would be happy to administer a stream, say Sevillanas as I have an interest. Im an old fart so have the time. The younger guys, the students and the pros have other pressures. To administer needs consistancy. But the job could be very simple. Delete rubbish, off topic and filler. If in doubt consult the experts (we are lucky we have so many happy to contribute) by email so not to clutter the other streams. It could be for a trial period with say just two or three streams and if it doesnt work then kill it.

But be assured Ron that once this discussion has run its course if you and-or Simon are against then thats fine by me. United we stand, divided we fall



Ron.M -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 10:25:07)

Thanks Nigel,

Another thought I had is this...

Perhaps Simon could implement a kind of "Form" entry for Didactic Audio/Video uploads, so that the uploader would choose from various boxes exactly what was being uploaded.

ie a selection box for PALO (including NOT RELEVANT)
same for LEVEL (Advanced, Intermediate, Beginner)
same for TECHNIQUE (Rasgueado, Tremolo, Alzapua etc)

etc etc

That way would avoid spelling and typo errors that could confuse the search engine and would force the user to title his upload in the proper format.

The Advanced Search Engine could then be the same kind of form which would work in reverse.

Also, to save server space, the post could just be a link to the users own ISP server or commercial file storer, but the text comments and replies would exist on our own server.

Just some thoughts...

cheers

Ron



sorin popovici -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 14:41:11)

quote:

Also, to save server space, the post could just be a link to the users own ISP server or commercial file storer, but the text comments and replies would exist on our own server


that's my idea ...i said it in the 1st page[8D],oh well...anyway.



Ron.M -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 6 2006 16:14:06)

quote:

that's my idea ...i said it in the 1st page ,oh well...anyway.


Sorry there Sorin, I didn't realise I had stolen your idea.[;)]

Seriously though, I don't believe in choosing a particular commercial storage for all the uploads, for the control of the material is then lost.
The storage company can then change the rules, start charging for downloads, or simply pull the plug, and we could lose years worth of archived material.

Spreading the load amongst our own ISP's and various storage facilities lessens the problem of complete loss.

All your huevos in one basket and all that stuff, so to speak... [:D]

cheers

Ron



Doitsujin -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 7 2006 17:23:31)

Some thoughts:

I dont think that a level of dificulty is important. Every exerise is good, no matter how hard to do. By the way, every exercise is hard when you play it for first time no?
Palo isnt important, too. Coz the target is to get a better technice with exercises, no? I think the technic has to stand in the spotlight, not the palo.



sorin popovici -> RE: Please Vote (Jan. 7 2006 19:57:45)

inteligent post

I agree with Doitsujin ...palo is not important ,but difficulty should be rated .
I worked for smth two years before getting a glimpse of how should it be done ...
so I wouldnt like to spend two years in smth too hard if the didactical purpose
in that falseta is very little.

But anyway ,I also vote ...for technique oriented....thumb ,alzapua ,tremolo ,
picado,rasgueados.. whatever...but i would like a little rhytm before the falseta
(somehow my bulerias rhytm is like they write it in books ,and not like today
is played( a tab would always help,but i understand it's too hard to write
something that u probably do once ))

I dont agree Phrygus. I need a slow version,windows media player is not that
great ...and u cant compare a slow version of windows mp with a real one.

I dont need from any angle ...I say just one for the normal version(but
to be able to see both hands)...and one slow (again with both hands showing in the video) .

That's all....I think it's an exageration to film it from any angle ,like I can see my playing from any angle if I'm gonna learn it(not that I didnt apreciate the trouble Flo)



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