RE: Son of Firefingers (Full Version)

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Ron.M -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 13 2005 22:45:02)

James,
What I love about these "nuevo" albums are the titles...
Like... (making it up...but not too much..LOL!)


Track Title
1 Guadalquivir (Rumba)
2 El Sangre y el Río (Rumba)
3 Alegrías (Rumba)
4 La Luna y el Mar (Rumba)
5 Fandangos (Rumba)
6 Sevilla (Rumba)
7 Mí Corazón (Rumba)
8 Bulerías (Rumba)


Sorry for being such a cynic! [:D]

cheers

Ron



JBASHORUN -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 13:44:02)

Ron,
If what you say is true, and this guy is playing Rumbas and pretending that they are Fandangos, then I agree- this is clearly not acceptable. I have nothing at all against Nuevo Flamenco, but when it pretends to be something it isn't then I do take objection.
However, lets not be so quick to push all Nuevo Flamenco into the same boat... some of them are happy just to play rumbas and are completely honest about what they are doing.



James

ps: Rumbas may perhaps be the simplest of Flamenco compas, but they are as much a part of Flamenco as any other palo, no?



Ron.M -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 15:01:40)

Hi James,
No I'm not saying they are pretending that the form is Fandangos or Bulerias or whatever.....it's just that they tend to use these kind of titles for their songs.
Rumbas are great, and very difficult to play well, but if I wanted a whole album of rumbas then there are compilation CDs etc by authentic Flamenco artists I'd choose first.

cheers

Ron



Ricardo -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 15:32:47)

The guy is playing spanishy stuff in 4 time, but he does not really even know rumba. I think his show is very cool though with the hot girls dancing and grabbing his legs with the wind blowing his hair. I find it inspiring when dorks become super cool and famous. One day he should actually learn how to play guitar, but I don't think he will, and he certainly doesn't need to. The only thing that bothers me is the guy's own ignorance about musical styles, but I don't think he means any disrespect. Aficionados should not let this stuff get to them, though I understand why it is annoying.

Ricardo



JBASHORUN -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 15:47:02)

quote:

No I'm not saying they are pretending that the form is Fandangos or Bulerias or whatever.....it's just that they tend to use these kind of titles for their songs.
Rumbas are great, and very difficult to play well, but if I wanted a whole album of rumbas then there are compilation CDs etc by authentic Flamenco artists I'd choose first.



Ron,
He might not be straight out lying, but if your song is not a Fandango and you call it something along the lines of a Fandango, then to me that is slightly misleading/pretentious. Although I'm sure they just do it to add a sort of Spanish "mystique" and authenticity.
As for compilation CDs of rumbas by authentic Flamenco artists... I like a good rumba, so let me know if there's any one particular CD that you had in mind.


Gracias!


James



Skai -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 16:03:54)

Hmm I think the Gypsy Kings would know their rumbas really well.



JBASHORUN -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 16:13:38)

quote:

I think the Gypsy Kings would know their rumbas really well.



Thanks, I already have "The Very Best of The Gypsy Kings" album... and quite like it. Songs like "Volare" and "Baila Me" are fantastic! But even the Gypsy Kings are considered by many not to be "Flamenco Puro", and I was more thinking of a CD with a collection of rumbas by guys better known for more complex palos.


James



Miguel de Maria -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 16:43:00)

I think the guys who specialize in rumbas would have better rumbas. For example, the Gipsy Kings or Peret. There is a certain Spanish or flamenco sound that I really like, that the GKs have but people like Benise, Ottmar, Strunz, Jesse Cook, etc. just don't have. I guess Ron might say it was an "accent". Or actually he might say "ahkSCENT."

I do like Riqueni's rumba from his Alcazar de Cristal CD. It almost seems that "real flamencos" don't quite know what to do with them for the most part. It's a style without an identity. As long as you can play the beat, anything goes. People really like "Mundo", but what the heck IS that? Even George Benson said he thought it was weird, and he played on the track! :)



JBASHORUN -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 17:01:38)

quote:

I think the guys who specialize in rumbas would have better rumbas. For example, the Gipsy Kings or Peret.


Thanks, I'll order Peret's "Rey De La Rumba"... looking forward to it! [:D]



James



Ron.M -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 14 2005 21:18:28)

quote:

Or actually he might say "ahkSCENT."

You've got it exactly Mike! (ask Simon..) LOL!

Yeah Peret....Rumba is one of the most exportable of Flamenco forms, and great when done well.
A lot of Spanish folk who are not really into Flamenco love rumba.
Rumba is a bit like Rock 'n Roll IMO.
It's best heard really loud IMO...beating out of a Juke Box in a bar in Madrid.

Peret was the King de la Rumba!

There were certain areas of Madrid where his stuff poured out of bars from 8am till 3.00am the following morning!


Juke Boxes in Andalucia when I was there tended to pour out a lot more Fandangos and Bulerias, with barely a Rumba at all!

Guess is the North/South divide, Spanish style? [:D][:D]

cheers

Ron



musicalgrant -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 15 2005 2:28:03)

I see where we have been going wrong!!!
All these years of hard practice learning the traditional forms of flamenco seem to be a wast of time.

Just get some funding, dancers,fancy lights, a bit of spanish sounding guitar, mix it all up with a long haired guitarist and HEY, you will make loads of money...[8D]

That is where i have been going wrong, stik to the art of flamenco and you will stay very poor, but take it to the entertainment level and hey presto, loads of money!!!

I cant see myself doing that somehow, but hey i suppose it beats working for a living[;)]

Good luck to the guy,
if the public are happy to pay for that then more fool them

Cheers Grant



sorin popovici -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 15 2005 3:46:36)

i can grow my hair ,but how do i get the chicks to dig me?That's what I dont know [:@]



JBASHORUN -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 15 2005 10:17:28)

quote:

That is where i have been going wrong, stik to the art of flamenco and you will stay very poor, but take it to the entertainment level and hey presto, loads of money!!!



Lets not forget that the primary aim of music in some cultures is "to entertain". As Thomas Whitely says, its a bit like the Roman Colloseum. If I had a dollar for every pretty girl that rode to success on the back of her looks or for every rapper that rode to success of the back of sex drugs and violence, then surely I'd be rich too!

Now that I mention it, thats slightly sad and says something about society. I once read a review of one of guitarist Eduardo Niebla's concerts and it said (quote) "It would have been good... IF he had some half naked, pretty young girls dancing on stage while he played.

Go figure! [:D]



James



Skai -> RE: Son of Firefingers (Dec. 15 2005 10:22:06)

You just need flamenco MTVs like the Macarena. 2 old men in suits singing with a bunch of sexy girls dancing around them. Ricky Martin is an excellent cantaor as well with his butt shaking.

Or else look to Ron's video where he played Cipres. The long hair swinging will cover any defects on your face and you'll look cool as well. [;)]



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