Mano a mano (Full Version)

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aeolus -> Mano a mano (Oct. 21 2013 22:03:11)

Top of the field classical player take on PDL





Aniello could benefit from a guitar with a dryer acoustic perhaps.

quien es mas macho



tele -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 21 2013 22:51:57)

quote:


Aniello could benefit from a guitar with a dryer acoustic perhaps.

quien es mas macho


I agree but I think the place where it was recorded and effects on the recording are affecting the sound in this piece also. I would like to hear him play it on a cypress guitar[;)]

very boring and too much silence when compared to paco's playing[8D]
Otherwise great[;)]



Ricardo -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 21 2013 23:19:45)

It's not the guitar so much as technique. I approve of the idea to interpret that piece in a classical style, but the problem here is mostly timing. I mean it's a free piece but a perfect example where a good sense of timing will influence the phrasing. The dramatic pausing between phrases just doesn't work sorry. It makes the piece very boring sounding, it needs to flow better. THe tremolo needs work technically speaking. Tons of top classical players could do that section justice IMO. He needs to look at filing the nails better or something. When he gets into the fast ligados and such it sounds good. Too bad the end is cut off.

Ricardo



Leñador -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 1:28:46)

No bueno
He took an incredibly dramatic piece and by trying to make it even more dramatic just made it boring. Also, it sounds like a bike with oval tires......



mark indigo -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 12:32:50)

I think you should have posted this PDL Tarantas, 'cos this is the one the classical guy is trying to play



I have another classical guitarist playing this on cd. I will try to post it, or an excerpt, for comparison.



tele -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 13:45:49)

Stuff like fuente y caudal is not to be messed with![:@] Almost a holy piece of music...[;)]



aeolus -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 14:13:30)

Re Mark I.
Thanks for that but the first is pretty close and the timing for all three about the same. The classical tremolo just doesn't get it here and Paco has pauses so don't hold that against Aniello I was curious why he performed it and checking his discography it's included in an album entitled Spain which includes works by Turina and Pujol. Totally appropriate.
Aniello can be wildly idiosyncratic as this performance of Asturias live shows.




Miguel de Maria -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 14:37:28)

I think it was his Cadiz that was totally crazy. Classical guitar can get pretty boring (although not as boring as solo flamenco guitar), so you exaggerating the highs, lows, fasts, and slows is important.



Ricardo -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 14:40:32)

quote:

Thanks for that but the first is pretty close and the timing for all three about the same.


uh no, not even close.

quote:

Classical guitar can get pretty boring (although not as boring as solo flamenco guitar), so you exaggerating the highs, lows, fasts, and slows is important.


Also, NO.



el carbonero -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 14:47:58)

Ok it's not paco,but who is paco?

We can ear his sound is not flamenco
but dont exagerate this guy have a good technique and play well.
In my computer the tremolo sound good



Grisha -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 14:51:28)

Here is another version from a classical guitarist complete with exaggerated pauses.



I liked Anielo's version. He hears it completely differently from me and makes me rethink a few lines.



el carbonero -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 17:18:42)

Grisha is a classic player??

good grisha!
picado and tremolo are better than the other



el carbonero -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 17:28:39)

hey grisha i am watching a calssic video of you in youtube with a guy call
jeromme mouffe

his guitar have an incredible powerfull sound for a classical.what is it?



withinity -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 19:24:10)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Miguel de Maria

I think it was his Cadiz that was totally crazy. Classical guitar can get pretty boring (although not as boring as solo flamenco guitar), so you exaggerating the highs, lows, fasts, and slows is important.


What the... how do you have 2.8k posts on this forum.



aeolus -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 20:43:01)

quote:

What the... how do you have 2.8k posts on this forum.


Maybe that's why he finds flamenco guitar solos boring .Heard 2 many of them. [:D]

There was a time, long, long ago when pyrotechnics on the guitar were all that was needed to pass as a master. Even Segovia noted this in his partial autobio scofffing at the awe in which Llobets technique was held: all you needed to do was play some fast scales to impress. Tons of top classical players could do that section justice sayth Recordo. So true. What is needed are fresh interpretations which is what Ariello must have realized that at this juncture going before the paying public with Asturius took some nerve. In the 3 versions of PDL's Tarantas all are played with a mastery beyond dispute. I could only fasten on certain
passages which I found beguiling such as the descending slurred bass under the tremolo at about 1:37, advantage Ariello; and the legato ascending runs at about 4:0, advantage Grisha.



Erik van Goch -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 22:55:18)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grisha

Here is another version from a classical guitarist complete with exaggerated pauses.

I remember seeing a youtube post showing you playing it in a guitar shop (trying out/promoting one of the guitars). That recording seems to be vanished (or mislabeled) since i can't tack it. The pauses in the video you included are totally different and way more acceptable as the ones Aniello seems to favor :-)



Guest -> [Deleted] (Oct. 22 2013 23:05:33)

[Deleted by Admins]



guitarbuddha -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 23:15:21)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shroomy726

Why do you keep comparing classical vs flamenco, aelous?


A pig taunts you from the sty not just because he loves the mud, he suspects you will love it too. Like a child in the swimming pool.


D.



guitarbuddha -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 22 2013 23:21:06)



Oink!!



Bliblablub -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 23 2013 0:05:03)

Not even close.



Ricardo -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 23 2013 2:19:22)

quote:

sayth Recordo.


No worries. I learned my lesson this time, finally. No more feeding the troll.



Guest -> [Deleted] (Oct. 23 2013 2:25:33)

[Deleted by Admins]



Ricardo -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 23 2013 3:31:46)

Oh hell, before I drop it. The thing the classical player needs to get the interpretation right is a little of THIS work under the belt:




aeolus -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 23 2013 10:03:59)

It's all good. I wasn't trying to desecrate the sacred art of flamenco. Just note something that is rare: a classical player playing a flamenco piece. It is interesting that Grisha was the only respondent that wasn't horrified at the temerity of it and even had found something of use. Figures.



guitarbuddha -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 23 2013 10:36:46)

quote:

ORIGINAL: aeolus

Just note something that is rare: a classical player playing a flamenco piece.


Honestly not the case. Most classical players have a little trick bag of flamenco,pop, blues and whatnot for which they clearly have genuine affection.

Any hostility tends to be caused entirely by concerns over market share, audience loyalty and good old fashioned insecurity.

D.



tele -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 23 2013 11:00:49)

I think the bottom line is that we should respect alot these two guitarists who can play this piece as it's very difficult. Of course not even close to the original when it comes to feeling and technique but I don't think there are anyone who can get close to paco's way of playing it.[8D] Both of these matters are meant to be compliments[;)]



mark indigo -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 24 2013 9:00:24)

here is the other classical guitarist I have heard play fuente y caudal




guitarbuddha -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 24 2013 10:51:50)

Well I enjoyed that and I enjoyed Grisha and of course I enjoyed Paco. And the other guy is always pushing the envelope and it was an interesting listen.

I loved the Naxos guitar editions. Norbert Kraft is a great player and he put out a lot of solid classical guitar CDs with emerging players. And not just the annual new guy plays the Recuerdos stuff that the main stream labels swamped music store shelves with.

Never saw the Martinez before but he is making a clear statement to any classical guitar afficianados. ie 'Classic' guitar is whatever is played on guitar and lasts and that Paco is a composer as worthy as any other. Anyway I like the style on the recording placing Paco stylistically with Moreno Torroba and Turina is fine by me. Sure this isn't all that there is to Paco but he is a diverse artist.

It is good that the facile prejudices of the Segovia generation seem to be fading. So many things do in the light of day.

D.



aeolus -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 24 2013 11:01:23)

Born: 1975 - Granda, Spain

The Spanish guitarist, David Martínez began his musical studies at seven years of age with his father, while singing as soloist of the Granada Conservatory Choir. He later studied with his uncle, professor Carmelo Martínez, graduating in 1993 from the Superior Conservatory of Granada with the silver medal of the Young Interpreters of the Musical Youth of Granada. He was then accepted to the class of the Mozarteum of Salzburg, Austria, with Joaquín Clerch and Eliot Fisk as professors. In 1998, he was selected to be part of the hommage to Andrés Segovia in Granada, and at the Hochschule für Musik in Munich in Germany. He has taken master-classes with David Russell, Hugo Geller, Jose Tomas, Ivan Rijos and Anthony Spiri in Ancient Music.

The tab I found shows a 5 note tremolo!



aeolus -> RE: Mano a mano (Oct. 24 2013 21:38:48)

quote:

It is good that the facile prejudices of the Segovia generation seem to be fading. So many things do in the light of day.


Where that the case here as a post of a classical performance induces reactions similar to Dracula presented with a cross. .



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