Erik van Goch -> RE: Emphasizing compas downbeats (Sep. 24 2012 23:43:37)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: dararith quote:
Here's one solea that shows how emphasizing the accents isn't too straightforward, and I would appreciate more tips on learning about "compas relation to the guitar". Diego del Morao's Ganaina?? Yes...it's very beautiful. He plays with the rhythm a lot and may not even accent on where you think the accents are for a solea...but it grooves with the compas...there's no rule. Try doing palmas with it, if you hadn't already. See if you can hold the compas WHILE listening to his music. You'll hear how he plays with the rhythm in accent before the expected accents to give it more emphasis, and the melodic phrasing even hints at it too (although Diego takes this a step further and go against the expected at times). I think people play this way since they already have compas security and don't want to limit themselves to the standard accents. Diego is exceptional at this. In my opinion this says it all. Music is like language, to express yourself you need to learn the words, the grammar and the correct pronounciation. Asking how Diego's Solea is related to the compas feels a little bid like asking to explain Shakespeare to someone who just started to learn english. Compas (like language) is learned in small steps by the principle of monkey see, monkey do. The answers you seek can only be found by listening to the masters a lot and by playing a lot yourself. Finding yourself a good coach/teacher (and trying not to solve everything in 1 day) can be a big help. So in stead of asking us to explain the complete shakespeare (which takes a lifetime) just start with a couple of tunes you feel comfortable with and work your way up from there. For a start try if you can fallow/hold the compas when you listen to the masters, like dararith suggested. Over the years (the relation to) the compas will become more and more clear up to a point were it becomes second nature. Paco de Lucia is an excellent place to start your investigations since he is always very clear in his compas and played very structural for years before he allowed himself some more freedom. You can indeed listen to his tracks in order of recording date like Ricardo suggested. In fact i did so myself since i listen to both Paco de Lucia/Paco Peña since the early 70ties and witnessed (an important part of) that evolution first hand. Ricardo also suggested to fallow the trail of evolution by listening to the old masters as well. You might run into a famous Soleares played by Niño Ricardo that "includes" the famous and (prehistoric) ligado (binding) introduction: -0--------------------------------0-------------------------------0--------------------0--------0------------------------------ -0--------------------------------0-------------------------------0--------------------1--------0-------------------*----------- -1--------------------------------1-------------------------------1--------------------2--------1------------------------------ -2-3-2-0--2-3-2-0--2-x-x-x--2-3-2-0--2-3-2-0-2-x-x-x--2-3-2-0--2-x-x-x-3-x-x-x-2-x-x-x--x-x-x-x--x-x-x-x ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1.............2............3.............4...........5............6...........7............8...........9..........10........11..........12 The chords at 9 and 10 are basic soleares. The preceding bindings are practiced by many generations in various settings. Probably the most famous variation (annotated above) involves the sequence <2320,2320,2xxx> being played on 1,2,3, repeated on 4,5,6 and then comes back in a shorter version covering 7/8 2320,2320,2xxx,2320,2320,2xxx,2320,2xxx 1.......2.......3,.....4.......5.......6,......7......8,..... So the compas relation is that the bindings are extended to (and stop on) main beats 3, 6 and 8. This seems to be a perfect example of a melody that fallows compas rules but at the same time it isn't. Actually i wouldn't be surprised if the famous 2320,2320,2 part originally was't intended for beat 1,2,3 at all. If i remember well Niño Ricardo's adaption of the theme in his famous soleares dropped it at beat 3,4,5! In that variation the bindings don't END on the main accents but START on the main accents (3 and 6). This would also explains the (seemingly misplaced) chord-stroke that start the theme. Normally chord-pulses like that are used to emphasize the main accents and in Niño Ricardo's version that was exactly what they were doing, emphasizing beat 3 and 6. But before you jump to conclusions >>>chords can be played at any given location of the compas as long as it is tasteful and fits the total picture. -0---------------------0----------0---------0------------0-------------------------------0--------0-- -0---------------------1----------0---------1------------0-------------------------------1--------0-- -1---------------------2----------1---------2------------1-------------------------------2--------1-- -2-3-3-0--2-x-x-x--3-x-x--x--2-x-x-x--3-x-x-x-x--2-3-2-0--2-3-2-0-2-x-x-x--3-x-x-x--2- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- .1.............2...........3.............4...........5...............6............7...........8............9...........10 The same idea but slightly different: -0----------0---------0----------0---------0------------0-------------------------------0--------0 -0----------1---------3----------2---------1------------0-------------------------------1--------0 -1----------2---------4----------3---------2------------1-------------------------------2--------1 -2-x-x--x--3-x-x-x--5-x-x-x--4-x-x-x--3-x-x-x--x--2-3-2-0--2-3-2-0-2-x-x-x--3-x-x-x-2 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I have no idea how old the theme is (i believe it already occurs in transcriptions around 1900, way before Niño Ricardo adapted it). I have no idea if the bindings originally were supposed to start on the main beats or to finish on them (both ideas are practiced). These various versions show that compas-relationship is not something that can be "caught" in a list of "everlasting" rules but is subject to context and personal/collective taste and evolution. At the same time there are strict rules indeed and nothing Diego and other masters are doing is done randomly. That's why we still consider it to be flamenco. Niño Ricardo happened to be an emotional player and sometimes his fabulous ideas missed a beat in the heat of the battle. Paco Peña plays lot's of traditional flamenco of Niño Ricardo, Sabicas and Ramon Montoya with equal or improved compas-structure. Like i stated before, compas is EVERYWHERE (clapping, feet-taps, music) but the most important compas is the one we tap and the one we feel INSIDE! When Diego plays the Solea (por bulerias) you posted i have no problem understanding the compas-relationship because (like diego) i enjoy the events ON TOP of the basic compas i feel inside. Everything he plays is done very tasteful and he basically is exploring (but not abandoning) acceptable compas behavior. So once again everything has to be guided/measured/enjoyed ON TOP of an internally felt compass (preferably settled in your DNA). And that internally felt compas can change depending on the melodic/rhythmic pulse. Although the official pulse of soleares, alegrias, bulerias and solea (por bulerias) promotes accents on 3,6,8,10,12, many, many melodies fallow a different accentuation. Fortunately the majority of these (to untrained ears maybe non conformistic) variations fit into one of usually well known alternative compas-pulses. Bulerias has main accents on 12-3-6-8-10 but many melodies fallow other accents. Personally i go with the flow so if a bulerias melodie fallows a 2 or 3 beat pattern over a longer period of time both my foot taps and my inner compas temporary adapts the same pulse: Adapting a 3 beat pattern in bulerias (accents on12-3-6-9): 12--3--/6-8-10- (basic) 12--3--/6-8-10- (basic) *********************** 12--3--/6--9-- (adapting a 3 beat pattern, repeated as long as needed) 12--3--/6-(8-10) (concluding compas before returning to basic) *********************** previous conformation just copied the first half of the compas (12--3-->>>6--9--). If it copies the second half (6-8-10) it conforms to a 2 beat pattern 12--3--/6-8-10-(basic) 12--3--/6-8-10-(Basic) ************* 12-2-4/6-8-10- (adapting a 2 beat pattern as long as needed) 12-2-4/6-(8-10) (concluding compas before going back to basis) 12-2-4 basically feels the same as 6-8-10. If this 2 beat pulse continues over a longer period of time additional chains can be added in 6 beat chains feeling/tapping the pulse *-*-*- (either 12-2-4-or 6-8-10). Depending on the melody these short *** chains can be added paired (still feeling full compas) or unpaired. This last option is called half compas. Various aspects involved i mentioned at another post involving a bulerias falseta played by diego. In all previous variations you can give (even bigger) accents on 12 and 6, being the REAL downbeat of every 6 beat chain (downbeat officially means 1st beat of a bar). So in Bulerias i vary my inner pulse to fit the melody..... i can switch instantly and without thinking between: 12--3--/6-8-10- 12--3--/6--9-- 12-2-4-/6-8-10 Personally i alter both my inner compas AND my foot tapping to fit the natural pulses of the melody, but various people adapt various systems: Paco de lucia basically can tap (12)**-**-**-** with all melodies (which indeed fit's al pulses) Moraito and Diego basically can tap *-*-*-/*-*-* with all melodies. So foot taps can vary from moment to moment and from person to person and sometimes seem to fallow a completely different pulse as the music you hear. The previously mentioned morao-2-beat pulse drives me mad when adapted on top of a 3 beat pattern melody, but that's how they do it. And it doesn't hinder them to play the right accents in conflicting melodies because (as you know) foot taps are just one pillar to time your notes, the other pilar is the compas you feel INSIDE which can fallow a completely different pulse. I have no idea what a morao feels inside when he taps a 2 beat pattern on top of a 3 beat melody. Bulerias is not the only style adapting alternative accent lines. In the previously mentioned soleares variation (top one) i personally don't feel accents on 3, 6 and 8 but simply go with the flow of the chords (1--4--7-9,10-(12) but for the sake of argument i just played it FEELING accents on 3,6,8 and 10 in stead and that worked out extremely well to...that's also how i would clap it) Another (antique) pulse occasionally occurring in soleares, alegrias and solea is >.>....>....../>.>.....>.......... 1-2-3-4-5-6/7-8-9-10-11-12 The second part (7,8-10--) also is a basic pattern for hand clapping and the first half simply copies that. This pulse occasionally adds an extra half compas as well (adding 6 extra beats to the compas). So to understand copas relationship first of all you must have an inner relation with the compas yourself. Once you have a severe inner compas, know the various (and sometimes opposite) structural conformations that can occur within a compas and are able to switch from one conformation to the other without thinking, then you are able to enjoy flamenco like intended. This can not be learned in a day or a week or a month, it takes years. So my advise is to combine: Studying the compas treatment of masters like Paco de Lucia and Paco Peña. Picking up the guitar yourself, restricting to material that fits your (growing) technical level/compas awareness. "Restrict" your questions to practical levels like how to feel/interpret the (simpler) material you are learning to play. If possible take some lessons with an expert. The answers will come over the years in bits and pieces.
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