Where to begin (Full Version)

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nickmontez -> Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 15:15:39)

My journey into the world of flamenco, just as any mans journey starts, started with a woman. I honestly don't know if it was the girl or her flamenco dancing that i fell in love with. I bought a guitar last November with the desire to play for her while she danced. Well, that enchantress is no longer in my life, however, the love for flamenco still remains.

Dancing and singing have never been my strong points but music has become an important part of my life. I have been playing the piano for about 8 years now. I mostly play blues/gospel music by ear, however, I am no stranger to music theory. I understand the how to improvise yet maintain the feel of the song that you are playing. The transition to the guitar is not that easy coming from the piano. I am barely starting to transition to different chords without having to think hard about it.

I have been in the US Navy for almost 5 years now and have not been able to play much music during that time. Buying the guitar has given me the ability to take music with me everywhere. I am so glad I met that girl even though she broke my heart because it made me make a large leap into the unknown.

Well my question for you all is this. Where would you recommend for me to start? With the piano, I focused on building my technical ability to be able to move freely around the keys and play in any key. What exercises would you recommend practicing daily to build up my ability to play?

I look forward to all your input.



Leñador -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 16:03:45)

Like piano I'd say familiarity with the fretboard is pretty paramount. I don't think you need to learn to play everything in every key. GENERALLY, most guitar music is written for the guitar and your not going to hear a lot of "That was nice, now can you play it F#?". In flamenco specifically they use a cejilla(capo) to change the keys so it's all the same shapes and movements just a little higher up the board. Chords and scales would be best place to start, I'd say for beginning Emaj/min/phrygian and Amaj/min/phrygian chords and scales would be a good beginning, and I only say phrygian because your into flamenco. There are a couple of fingerings that are somewhat uniquely flamenco that you may want to familiarize yourself with. A major with index covering your E and A, and middle finger covering the C#. Also, the Bb that's like the swiss army chord in flamenco. Search the forum for Bb fingerings and you'll find some. You can start practicing different rasgueados in the mean time as well. Unfortunately you'll have to get somewhat of a basic guitar base down before you can approach learning flamenco proper. Learn a couple songs that you like (from any genre) that are simple enough that you don't get frustrated. When you're ready for flamenco proper I'd recomend Juan Martin's book "Ele arte de la guitarra flamenca" and hugely important, listen listen listen. I'd say older flamenco just because the different palos are a little more obvious. Sabicas, Paco Pena, Monolo Sanlucar etc....Don't give up! Guitar players get more chicks then piano players!
[:D]



Don Dionisio -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 16:14:35)

Welcome to the foro. If you really want to learn flamenco music with the
guitar, you have to understand that it is very challenging. I recommend that
you try to find a real teacher (instead of a video teacher) and learn to use your hands, ears, eyes,
etc. One of the most important things is to develop a love for the music
not just the guitar. Flamenco is a way of life and the music is very powerful
but to some it is very challenging as well. The song (cante) is an inseparable
part of flamenco; take the time to develop a taste for flamenco song. Listen
to the old masters like Antonio Chacon, Nina de Los Peines, Pepe Marchena,
Fernanda y Bernarda de Utrera, Antonio Mairena, Terremoto, among many
others. And, listen to the newer masters like Cameron de la Isla, Fosforito,
El Lebrijano, Enrique Morente, etc.
Good luck with your flamenco ventures.



Ricardo -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 16:59:50)

quote:

My journey into the world of flamenco, just as any mans journey starts, started with a woman. I honestly don't know if it was the girl or her flamenco dancing that i fell in love with. I bought a guitar last November with the desire to play for her while she danced. Well, that enchantress is no longer in my life, however, the love for flamenco still remains.


Well, I have to ask man, WHO she was, seeing how you are in Annapolis I probably know her. [:D]

If you want, I will give you lessons so that you can turn it all around and break dancer's hearts if you want.[;)]



nickmontez -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 17:02:19)

I most certainly understand that flamenco is very challenging. I have lots of patience and am in no rush to be able to play a "whole piece" as some people put it. I'm the type of person that would rather play a few things very well then fumble through an entire performance.

I have found a few different mentors over my summer travels with the Navy. All the traveling has not allowed me to find someone to give me steady lessons. Hopefully I when my summer travels are over I can find a good teacher. Is there anyone you would recommend in the Washington DC or Baltimore area? I hope to someday be stationed in Rota, Spain and just embrace all the flamenco of southern Spain has to offer.

I have Graf Martinez's book but it got looked up in my storage unit. will not be able to get to it for a few more weeks. I will look into Juan Martin's book when I get the chance.

I found this forum because I was looking for info for making a guitar. I currently have the Yamaha CG172SF but I quickly developing an ear for what makes a good guitar. I have some good wood working skills and I wanted a new challenging project so I considered making a guitar. I figured it would be a fun an rewarding experience to go along with my new found passion for flamenco. Hopefully I will be able to kick off that project before the end of September.

Guitar players may get chicks but I am in it for the music not the women :)



nickmontez -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 17:10:29)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo

Well, I have to ask man, WHO she was, seeing how you are in Annapolis I probably know her. [:D]

If you want, I will give you lessons so that you can turn it all around and break dancer's hearts if you want.[;)]



You might know her. I know two dancers actually. One of them is a very close friend who is at the Naval Academy with me. The one i fell for was her friend. Lessons from you would be great Ricardo. I was listening to some of you stuff on youtube yesterday as a matter of fact. I know you do Skype lessons but do you do them in person as well? The Department of Defense blocks Skype traffic on all of its networks :(



Leñador -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 17:19:02)

quote:

Guitar players may get chicks but I am in it for the music not the women :)


Hah, flamenco is way too much work to be in it for the women - the work to girls ratio is way off. I'd play emo or some bullsh if that were the case. But some women is decent side effect!

Take lessons from Ricardo, he's a monster!



nickmontez -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 17:35:11)

What strings would you guys recommend for the Yamaha CG172SF? I have tried a few different things so far. The EJ45s i think are my favorite so far.



Leñador -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 18:54:11)

I like EJ44's myself but most people don't. EJ46's are very popular, I think even Paco Pena uses those. You kinda just opened Pandora's box as far as peoples opinions on strings. Check out some of the other threads on strings.



NormanKliman -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 19:13:14)

quote:

I have lots of patience and am in no rush


That's good because it'll take you years. You'll have fun during this time, so don't despair, but it's going to be hard work. Although your knowledge of music will be useful, forget all of that for now. You've got to learn how to play the nylon-string guitar properly, from the way you hold the instrument to certain flamenco-specific techniques. There's also a lot to be learned about flamenco rhythms and chording. Further down the road, you'll want to learn how the guitar accompanies singing and dancing, to be familar with traditional lyrics, to know about the history of flamenco and its most famous artists from the past and present. If you do it right, you'll never get tired of flamenco (or at the very least, you'll keep coming back).

Basic techniques to focus on are rasgueados, arpeggios, picado, alzapúa, thumb-and-index mechanisms, tremolo... Build up a collection of your favorite specific exercises for warm-up (think of them as work clothes vs. evening clothes).



Arash -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 19:37:55)

You want lessons in washington?
who else better than than ricardo, you are lucky.
in my area there was only one "teacher" who was not even as good as i played myself, so i had to go for the encuentro videos, youtube, etc....



Sr. Martins -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 8 2012 21:32:39)

I think you should start by getting another girl, take care of business.. after that, if the will to play remains, go for it [:D]



nickmontez -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 9 2012 12:29:44)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rui Martins

I think you should start by getting another girl, take care of business.. after that, if the will to play remains, go for it [:D]


Well, its been a good while and another girl is sort of in my life and the will to play is stronger than ever.

I had a one guitar player tell me this, "98% of people don't understand or care much about flamenco, but that 2% are crazy about it." My roommates last semester are not part of that 2%.



Sr. Martins -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 9 2012 13:12:48)

Ahah, thats true. But there's another percentage of people (me included) that like flamenco a lot but never knew it because of flamingo/fakemenco music. You are "told" that crap is flamenco and you get turned off.

Until last year when I was browsing youtube and saw a HolyEvil (user here) video with some bulerias and it mentioned tomatito and I browsed "Tomatito Bulerias", thinking that it would be a song... Well, guess what video came up [:D]


Thats why Iam here.



nickmontez -> RE: Where to begin (Aug. 9 2012 13:24:27)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rui Martins

Ahah, thats true. But there's another percentage of people (me included) that like flamenco a lot but never knew it because of flamingo/fakemenco music. You are "told" that crap is flamenco and you get turned off.

Thats why Iam here.


I know what you mean. I had a friend that said that he played flamenco. What did he pull out to play...a really cheap steel string guitar[&:] And he played some really basic rumba strum with a "riff" in it. The "riff" was 4 beat section from a classical piece. He proceeded to tell me that he wanted to get the steel nail things that banjo players use....I just about punched him in the face.

On the subject of nails, I am finally getting good at taking care of them. Nails and piano do not mix at all. My nails are as long as I can have them in the military...yes there is regulations for just about everything. I bet I am the only guy that really pushes the limits of nail length...[:D]



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