NormanKliman -> RE: Paco de Lucia and the Contemporary Flamenco Guitar (Jun. 28 2009 3:12:08)
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Here are some of my impressions on all of this: You guys ought to be a little more careful in your criticism because it's not the first time I've seen mistaken interpretations of this guy's claims. When he says that guitarists don't use muting anymore, this appears next to a comment on alzapúa, but he doesn't say that nobody plays alzapúa anymore. And the comment about a 450 degree angle is obviously because he used the zero symbol (0) instead of the degree symbol (º) and meant to say 45º angle. But if you read through his text too quickly, I can hardly blame you. That's the main reason why I haven't really bothered to comment until now. I strongly disagree with his claims and I really don't like the way he's going about making them. Let's see... another talented guitarist who simultaneously dishes out extra helpings of hero-worship and contempt? Yeah, that's just what we need! In fact I think that's the biggest problem today rather than the ignorance or "lack of academic approach" that he mentions. Depositing all your faith in one person whom you hold above yourself is one of the more unfortunate human behavior patterns. In matters of life and death (i.e., politics and religion), it might be easier to understand, but this is art!!! If you want to see how this affects flamenco, look at the phenomenon of mairenismo. In one of Paco's interviews, he says that "everyone sang like Mairena and we all played like Melchor." He only analyzes bulerías, and only one bulería of each of several players. This makes for an extremely poor analysis that is representative of nothing, not even bulerías. He states, "This article is not for the sake of discredit or criticism of anyone..." but goes on to say, "...none of the guitar players above mentioned (...) have done any innovation or contribution in any field of flamenco guitar." I'm sorry, that's just talking trash. About the cross-legged position, there's a photo of a guitarist playing cross-legged at the Concurso de Granada in 1922. It's on the Sonifolk CD of recordings from García Lorca's record collection. The guitarist is propping the lower bout on his right thigh, so it's not the same as Paco's position, but his legs were clearly crossed in 1922, and that's the important part, IMO. Once your legs are crossed, it's just a matter of time (fatigue) before you're going to lower the neck and rest the guitar on your leg between the two bouts. About alzapúas, Diego del Gastor and Sabicas recorded alzapúas a few years before Paco de Lucía. The recordings of Diego are from informal gatherings and are not accurately dated, but it's the same timeframe, give or take a few years. Sabicas didn't use the same thumbstroke pattern, but it's clearly related. About "añadido," I've thought about his definition and checked out four or five of the references he offers but I still don't understand what he's talking about. If he means the silence between beats 10 and 12, he hasn't defined the term that way. About Montoya he says: Although at that time there was rhythmic reference (hand claps - palmas) while accompanying dance or singing, when playing alone, guitar players did not use hand claps to play over. What's this statement based on? Montoya made most of those solo recordings in Paris, and may have been traveling with just his guitar (no palmeros). Regarding the rest of his analysis of Ramón Montoya, it should be pointed out that over 7,000 recordings of flamenco were made up until the advent of modern recording technology (microsurco). We still don't know exactly how many there are, but Montoya plays on at least 500 recordings. Nobody has all of these recordings and certainly nobody has analyzed them all. A huge amount of ideas can be traced back to Montoya, and nobody should rule him out too quickly as a possible source. This applies particularly to the comments about Sabicas: 0:18: Certainly it was an innovation the use of chromatic scales as a melody to describe the following chord progression: V7 to bIII7 (min 0:21). 0:51: The use of chains of b3rds, never used before Sabicas... 1:10: Use of the aux. dominant V/VI, the goes to VIm. Certainly an innovation, for Ramon Montoya never did something like this, nor anyone else. Another of his comments: When the flamenco became widely known in the world in the first half of the last century (especially in United States) and became a good business, it was vital to keep a close secrecy about the essential principles of flamenco disguising it as “the mystery of the duende” in flamenco. That's ****. Spanish writers were saying the same thing at the beginning of the 20th century. Just look at Lorca, and he wasn't the first. I've also heard what Jason mentioned about David Serva and E-flat Phrygian. Adding to this, on several occasions I've seen David attribute his own ideas or those of others to Paco when asked. The point is that David admires Paco and has no problems crediting him for certain ideas (I suspect that in some cases the ideas really were David's, and that he was having a bit of fun), but in this case he clearly states that the E-flat thing is his. Why hasn't Ruben posted anywhere on the Paco de Lucía site? Edit: Just to keep this fair, if Ruben wants to respond to anything in my post, he can contact me through the e-mail address on my website, the URL of which is available through my forum profile.
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