6 weeks and still stretching...

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>Lutherie >>

Page: [1]

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

Graeme

Posts: 30
Joined: Apr. 2 2004
From: Lincoln, UK

6 weeks and still stretching...

Hi there,
Just about to disappointingly remove a set of six week old Savarez Alliance HT Classics from my Burguet but thought I'd ask here for your thoughts first.

I've been looking for a string to wake-up my Burguet 1aF for ages now. It stubbornly refuses to be "vibrant" when it knows damn well that "vibrant" is what does it for me. Yes, the intonation's great and it looks good. It even smells great, but I want "vibrant" too.

So. What are these Alliance things all about then? OK, my guitar is still dozing so they haven't worked on that score, but every time I pick it up those string things have stretched some more. And I'm not being a tuning pedant here... I mean really stretched. Assuming that the neck is not collapsing, does anyone know what's going on here?

Your comments welcomed!
Graeme

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 29 2006 17:31:25

comus

Posts: 23
Joined: Oct. 2 2006

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

Hi Graeme

it sounds like Savarez make their strings from rubber

if there still stretching now,Im not trying to teach my granny to suck eggs, but; Did you give them all a damn good yank when they were newly on the guitar, pulling them upwards firmly, then re tune and repeat several times, always works for me, especially on the top 3 strings which seem to take forever to bed in properly. If you dont do the above nylon strings will take forever and a day before they stay in tune

perhaps if anyone out there in flamenco land knew what brand of strings the Masters like Paco Pena and Paco di lucia use on there guitars, because their guitars have "Vibrancy by the bucket load"

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 14 2006 20:04:59

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

I have the same problem with the same strings. Although admittedly its only been about 3 weeks so far.

I must try that "giving them a yank" before puting them on trick.

Jb

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 12:35:43

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

Eh? I think top players may change their strings every show? My strings are dead after about 2 weeks and I don't even play that hard. I don't think they should be stretching anymore after a couple days of playing.

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 15:44:38

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

It might depend on how often you play, and for how long. Admittedly I haven't been playing that heavily lately. But every time I pick up the guitar the Savarez strings need re-tuning, whereas the LaBella ones don't. I'm guessing its the strings and not the guitar.

Jb

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 16:05:03

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to JBASHORUN)

Bash,
Forget all the sucking and yanking.. (

)

I used to use Saverez all the time until Anders told me about D'Addario EJ45's.
I don't practise that much but still had to change strings once every 4 weeks.
(at around a tenner a time!)
These D'Addarios just last forever and still sound OK.

cheers

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 20:33:08

Hugh

Posts: 130
Joined: Jul. 27 2006

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

I dont know how you guys get such a long life out of your strings. I get two weeks tops, then they go dull. I dont have much trouble working them in either, a few days and they are well stretched. I use Addario 45s too. I must hit them harder or something.
I read in a classical tutor somewhere, you must "not" pull the strings to stretch them.
This is ok for steel strings, but if you pull them, you run the risk of making the string thinner in some parts than they are in others, resulting in intonation problems.
I saw Simon Dinnegan at a guitar workshop once, and he was having stretching problems as he was taking the class. He just kept pulling the strings close to the bridge from side to side, and that seemed to work for him.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 21:33:32

Hugh

Posts: 130
Joined: Jul. 27 2006

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

Quote:Graeme.
And I'm not being a tuning pedant here... I mean really stretched. Assuming that the neck is not collapsing, does anyone know what's going on here?

May sound a bit obvious Graeme but, are you sure you have secured the strings properly both ends, and they are not just slipping?
Six weeks seems an awful long time for this amount of slipping to happen.
I'm usually thinking of putting on my third set by the sixth week.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 21:47:20

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Ron.M)

quote:

Forget all the sucking and yanking.. ( )

I used to use Saverez all the time until Anders told me about D'Addario EJ45's.
I don't practise that much but still had to change strings once every 4 weeks.
(at around a tenner a time!)
These D'Addarios just last forever and still sound OK.

Not sure how "sucking" would help. The reason the Savarez strings have lasted me over 3 weeks is because I cut my index finger with a chisel in the workshop, so I haven't been playing them heavily. That said, there are still indentation marks in the strings from the frets, and I did notice that they wear more easily than other brands.

I used to use D'addario EJ49s, but didn't like the basses, so I swopped over to LaBellas. Just thought I'd give the Savarez ones a try because I've heard so many people rave about them. The basses sound quite bright, which is good because my yamaha is a bit on the bass-heavy side.

I'll try the EJ45s too when I get a chance.

Jb

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 21:51:20

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Hugh)

quote:

I'm usually thinking of putting on my third set by the sixth week.

Like I said, it depends on how often (and hard) you play. And obviously some brands of strings wear down much quicker than others. Plus I rarely have problems with the trebles.

Personally, I leave the strings on my guitar as long as possible becuase I can't afford to buy new ones that regularly.

Jb

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 21:56:36

koella

Posts: 2194
Joined: Sep. 10 2005
From: holland

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

I found that of all the strings I used last year ( aranjuez, la bella, savarez, d'addario, ) luthier did stretch the least.
And they also sound best on my guitar, along with aranjuez high tension.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 21:58:55

Hugh

Posts: 130
Joined: Jul. 27 2006

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

I always used aranjuez on my classical. Lovely crisp basses and warm trebles on my guitar with them.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 15 2006 22:27:31

Jon Boyes

Posts: 1377
Joined: Jul. 10 2003

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

Hi Graeme

I have been using Savarez Alliance for a while and I like them - very bright edgy sound. I have not had any problems with them settling in. Unless its a duff set the most likely cause is the way you are securing the string at both ends as already mentioned.

As for the vibrancy, well try a few other sets of strings - different makes and tensions. I notice you are using high tension - that may be the problem for example.

If after trying a few makes/tensions you find nothing that works, it may be the guitar I'm afraid. I have played some Burguets that eally sang and sounded great, and one or two that were awful. Did the guitar sound good when you tried it out or did you buy mail order without trying it?

_____________________________

Spanish Guitarist in Devon, Cornwall and Somerset

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 16 2006 8:37:19

Graeme

Posts: 30
Joined: Apr. 2 2004
From: Lincoln, UK

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

Thanks for your responses and interesting that JB has noticed the same problem. I take your points about possible slippage but the problem has been with the wound as well as plain strings.

I do routinely stretch strings after fitting using the slot along the handle of the Planet Waves peg winder. How hard? Er, well, quite hard I suppose. Maybe not hard enough because I hate doing it (grit teeth - hum loudly - look in the other direction).

Have to say that I've not been playing the Burguet much since the Alliances went on because they have been disappointing tonally. Instead I've been playing a couple of second-hand guitars that each cost me £50 because they're FUN. I feel that a clue to the Burguet's dull character may be in its weight...... certainly the finish is very thick. These cheapo guitars are of lighter construction/finish and are much more alive.

So, I hear you saying, a good experiment would be to swap the Alliances onto one of the cheapos........

Yes it would. Back soon. Graeme

PS Jon: I bought the Burguet second-hand when I was a bit less discerning than I am now. The previous owner was using Savarez Reds but with nylon-wound trebles (all three) which had been a special order. He gave me some spares which I still have around somewhere....... experiment No.2........ I'd better light some candles in the lab.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 16 2006 21:13:38

Hugh

Posts: 130
Joined: Jul. 27 2006

RE: 6 weeks and still stretching... (in reply to Graeme)

Graeme, its funny you mentioned cheap guitars there. I was in Glasgow last friday, and while I was waiting for my wife to decide to come back from the shops, I found this outside market. I had a wander through, and came across this old classical cheapo on a stall. It was a Palma PL 50, which sells for around £70. I got it for £15.
It was a bit dull and dirty, so I got into it with T-cut and polish, and believe it or not, came up like new. It's obviously not been played much going by the condition of it.
I stuck a new set of Addario 46's on it and it sounds great for what it is.
So I now have three classicals. Dont know how many of you are familiar with DADGAD tuning, or Celtic tuning as its sometimes called, but I've left it in that mode, and its great to pick up and play, when I fancy a different sound other than either the classical or the flamenco. And it is really responsive, and the intonation it great too.
Just go's to show that you can get a sweet sound just for the price of a couple of sets of strings. I'm well chuffed. My initial idea was to punt it on Ebay, but now I'm keeping it for myself.

Another thing about your stretching problems - have you tried tightening the machine screws on the winders. Sometimes they can slip.
The strings I put on this cheapo last night have settled in already. Hardly any slippage at all.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 16 2006 21:35:23