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Question about string tension and influences on guitar
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XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
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Question about string tension and in...
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Maybe its a dumb question for the experts, or even a hypothetical one. But since I use hard tension strings, I fear, the guitar top can "break in" towards the soundhole, due to the pressure the fingerboard effects on the guitar body. I hope you know what I mean, maybe there is a more advanced expression for it. The point is the strings a reversed on the fingerboard, since I am lefthanded, and I know that guitar tops have those little pieces of wood, that should enforce the top against the pressure. But I dont know if they are placed symmetrical on my guitar. I mean, if somethings happens to the guitar then I am "FUBAR" coz I dont have the money for another (comparable!!!) guitar. So how would you estimate the "risk"? Ps: It is a brandless guitar, but very good. From 1976, what scares me also a bit. It has a very long scale and a quite broad fingerboard.
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Фламенко
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Date Jul. 4 2006 0:12:29
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Guest
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to XXX)
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Take it easy. Hard tension strings shouldnt damage your guitar and the fact that you use it vesa-versa because you are lefthanded doesn´t change that. The treble strings have equally high tension as the basses.
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Date Jul. 4 2006 7:24:14
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XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to XXX)
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Ok that makes me relax, thx Anders! @Doit: I remember having posted about this andhere it is. When I had the first guitar in my hands it was my cousin's and of course righthanded. I remember playing "come as you are" in a "lefty" way. Its just easier. I mean, only because you do something with both hands, it doesnt mean that right and left are exchangeable. That would be only the case, if r and l would do exactly the same motions, and even then, I think most people have a "favorite" hand, which can change from motion to motion too. I prefer to cut with right for example. Maybe its the same thing for you, just with the guitar. But its hard to find out because you already adapted to righthand playing. You would have had to practise long time with a lefthanded guitar to be able to say something. I dont know how you started on guitar, whether you had the opportunity and time, to check if your getting better away lefthanded. Because I can imagine most kids or beginners, can be influenced by the environment in a bad way that they would have to do it righthanded. So due to the pressure, not because it is easier for them to play righthanded they start learning it. You have to check both to be sure. Hehe and yes, there are also some righthanded that play left, because it works better for them Its really something between you and your instrument. Theres nothing wrong playing lefthanded. There are disadvantages, but those have nothing to do with the lefthandedness itself. They are more a problem of economical and social reasons (acceptance) But the most important reason why I play lefthanded is (of course) because I am the re-incarnation of Hendrix, MCCartney and Kurt Cobain in one person!
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Date Jul. 4 2006 12:20:52
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yoyocint
Posts: 3
Joined: Jul. 3 2006
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to XXX)
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I hate to disagree with Anders, but I will. Using hard or ultrahard tension strings can damage the guitar and a guitarrist's arm. I have read some of Romanillos writting on this topic. A guitar's top is a vibrating plate. Its efficiency depends on its mass/stiffness/bracing applied, among others. A guitar with a more mass, higher stiffness and heavy bracing applied to it, will require more energy to get excited and produce sound compared to one with less mass, less stiffness and lighter bracing applied. The use of high or ultra high tenssion came to vogue in large part due to the popularization of the Ramirez Style of construction ( long scale, stiff, heavy top and heavy bracing) which require higher tension strings to withstand the hard attack ( i.e. Segovia) and produce loud sound with not buzzing. Lighter construction guitars with regular 650mm or shorter scales ( Granada style) can be excited to produce loud volume with less energy applied to the top, also due to the shorter scales are less prone to buzz. However, the lighter less braced top construction ( as flamenco guitars are constructed) also mean that the top is more suceptible to deformation due to string pull. ( I have seen this) Thus as a matter of instrument integrity I would not recomend hard tensiono to be used in light constructed guitars. Pertaining to hurting a player's arm. The use of higher tension strings means that the hand that presess the strings to the frets has to press harder. If a player practicess for prolonged hours that excess of tension in the forearm muscles can lead to tendonitis in the elbow end of the muscle. ( I have also seen this hapen to classical guitarrists whi use hard tension strings) So depending on the construction of the guitar the use of hard tension strings is not needed, not recomendable, can damage the instrument in the long run and can cause permanent damage to the player.
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Date Jul. 6 2006 1:31:02
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Ron.M
Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to duende)
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Hi Henrik, Anders told me I was out of date in my string choice, (I was using Savarez High Tension..Red Card) and he shipped the guitar with D'Addarro EJ45C Normal Tension Strings. I was very impressed by their long life! This alone has saved me a lot of money as I didn't get much time out of the Savarez ones at all. This time when I reordered, I decided on a whim to try the High Tension ones in this range and I must say I am much happier about the "feel". It might just be a few grams difference in string displacement force, but it definitely feels a lot more "right" to me. The guitar (to me) sounds a bit more "lively" too. Over the last year I could definitely hear a slow change in the sound of the guitar towards deeper, more complex tones and I find that the High Tensions just balance that out to get a nice, warm but "brittle" sound. It's difficult to hear on my uploads as I have a terrible recording setup, not so much the equipment, but the room (which is my workshop) which is very "boxy" with reflective walls. But if you hear the guitar "live", it has lots of nice, subtle overtones.. like the myriad of flavours and spices you get in Indian cuisine. cheers Ron
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Date Jul. 7 2006 20:17:45
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gerundino63
Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to yoyocint)
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Hi Yoyocint, "Torres" constructed guitars, and "Granada" ( Ferrer) constructed guitars say more about the sice of the body than the scale. Hard strings are mostly used in flamenco, because you can put the strings lower than. It is questionable if it is easier for the hand to play with hard tension, and little lower, or mediumtension and a little higher. Also in my opinion, it is easier to do alzapua, rasq, picado on hard strings, but that is maybe because I am used to it. A little deformation behind the bridge is normal. I have played on two 70ties Gerundino's, I could see the braces through the soundboard, they surface behind the bridge looked like the ocean, but they sounded like hell! If you get trouble with the hand, try to press the strings down less hard. If you have a normal, good guitar, there is nearly no force nececary to press the strings down to make a tone. Welcome to the foro! Peter
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Date Jul. 7 2006 20:29:52
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Miguel de Maria
Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to XXX)
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Henrik, did you do a full-length guitar review on it? If not, maybe you could do that. It would be cool. I wonder if there's something very different about the way we do things. In my history I keep having injuries and also am very sensitive to minor things like action, string tension, and different guitars. My current guitar is a very sweet one, the easiest guitar to play I have had. If I try to play someone else's guitar I'm nothing! I need to try to figure out if there is a way to have a stronger technique. I do think that high tension strings must put more strain on the body, though. It seems to me that if you want to use normal tension, you should have a very lightly built guitar, with a very thin top and thin sides. It would seem that a high tension string would match a sturdier guitar. Incidentally, my Tezanos Perez is extremely heavy, like a classical (braz. rosewood), and I don't feel normal tension strings would work. I want to get one of those blancas that feels like a ukelele but roars with medium tension strings! And has a low action and great trebles. Can you make one of those Anders?
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Date Jul. 7 2006 22:03:42
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RE: Question about string tension an... (in reply to XXX)
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Modern professional flamenco players use all kinds of tension. Some use Low tension, because it makes the left hand easyer (pull offs and ons). Some use high tension because you can hit them harder and you get a more controlled feedback. Some like medium and go closer to the bridge when they want more tension. I´m like that myself. My guitars are build to work with hard tension, and the difference in a set of med. and hard tension strings is actually very small if you compare it in kilos. Take a look at the Daddario website, they have a page where you can compare the kilo tension in strings. Strings are harder tension nowadays than 30 years ago. Savaraz carte rosa is called hard tension, but they feel more or less like a modern set of mediums. Nice playing
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Date Jul. 8 2006 16:18:29
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