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How much would you buy a Reyes from the 70s?   You are logged in as Guest
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Carlos_ffm

 

Posts: 21
Joined: Jun. 11 2016
 

How much would you buy a Reyes from ... 
Hi there,

There are a few Reyes for sale around, and as we have many experts on this forum I´d be interested to know what price tag you would a priori put on a Reyes, for the buy to be considered as reasoable (being aware this of course also depends on the specific conditions of the guitar and that every guitar is unique).

The ones I consider are from the 70s, but any info regarding the different period of the builder is welcome.

Also, I have the impression their prices when up quite a bit in the past few years, is it also something you noticed?

Thank you in advance for your feedback, that would help me a lot in my thinking.

Kind regards,

Carlos.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 7 2019 21:40:33
 
sartorius

Posts: 206
Joined: Mar. 7 2017
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
Sadly these instruments have fallen in the investment category which makes them almost unaffordable for many. A few years ago professionnals in Europe were selling them around €9-10000 (about $15000 in the US because the market is different). Now you have to enquire to get the price tag. The price is around €13000-15000 for a good condition guitar that is one that may have a few professionally repaired cracks and probably a new or recent shellac varnishing. Pristine untouched original guitars fetch even higher prices.

Buying from a private is always a more affordable option but these are scarce. It is difficult but not impossible. You can't imagine what's around you even sometimes within ridiculous distances from you. Would you believe I bought a totally original hardly ever played 1960 Manuel de la Chica (equivalent renowned builder from Granada, same price range) in Belgium last year about 20 miles from home?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 6:13:34
 
Carlos_ffm

 

Posts: 21
Joined: Jun. 11 2016
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to sartorius) 
Thank you very much Sartorius for your swift answer, which is very much in line with the impressions I got.

Congratulations for your Manuel de la Chica - I could try one (a classical) in Siccas guitar and it had really something. It must make you happy everyday.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 14:10:16
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14801
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
These guitars used to be about $8000. The extra price over normal concert flamencos in the 5-6k range was due to the long wait list the guy had. Around the time his son’s guitars started appearing on the market (2000 or so, can’t remember the first one), the Dad’s guitars started increasing in value. I remember Gerardo Nunez had one he waited many years for and he only kept it a year (2002 I remember him using it). He prefered the Conde sound. Conde’s seemed to be the standard throughout the 90’s into early 2000’s, however I noticed the shift, and this is my personal view, due to Vicente and Tomatito always using them. Suddenly everybody wanted a Reyes, and the prices shot way up by mid 2000’s for no real reason other than they were more scarce than other guitars of similar quality. I find it hard to accept these guitars sell for $20K and such, especially if they happened to be looking like a Vicente or Tomatito style rosette or whatever. To me they are only worth the original 8K, I would not pay more myself. But the market is what it is because people drive it up there.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 17:40:43
 
benros

 

Posts: 144
Joined: Aug. 27 2016
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
here is one from 1970, which seems to be in decent condition:
https://www.mundo-flamenco.com/nc/gitarren/gitarren-details.html?tx_kwmundoguitars_pi3%5BshowUid%5D=622&cHash=4c2fc527fe5d923fb6bafb3b25df2708
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 18:37:39
 
Tom Blackshear

 

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
quote:

There are a few Reyes for sale around, and as we have many experts on this forum I´d be interested to know what price tag you would a prior put on a Reyes, for the buy to be considered as reasonable (being aware this of course also depends on the specific conditions of the guitar and that every guitar is unique)


For those who can afford a collectable instrument, anywhere from 12,000 to about 18,000 depending on the condition, and from a private owner, about 10,000 to 15,000.

An Hijo could sell from anywhere to about 12,000.

It seems that the 80's Reyes are some of the best he built; 1986 to 88.

And of course this is all speculative to say the least.

In today's economy, even the other high quality makers are not selling at break-neck speed.

_____________________________

Tom Blackshear Guitar maker
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 18:55:06
 
Carlos_ffm

 

Posts: 21
Joined: Jun. 11 2016
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Tom Blackshear) 
Thank you Ricardo and Tom for your feedback, which is very valuable to me!

I hadn´t spotted that offer benros, I will inquire!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 19:59:58
 
RobJe

 

Posts: 731
Joined: Dec. 16 2006
From: UK

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
3 more here

https://www.kentguitarclassics.com/guitars

Look under "inquire for price"

Perhaps this post should be under general - not really about lutherie, more about the mundane business of buying and selling.

Rob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 20:38:13
 
Carlos_ffm

 

Posts: 21
Joined: Jun. 11 2016
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to RobJe) 
quote:


Perhaps this post should be under general - not really about lutherie, more about the mundane business of buying and selling.

Rob

Indeed. I just couldn´t find where such a place was on the forum, sorry for this. I am more than happy if a moderator could transfer this thread to the appropriate place.

Thanks for the info re kent guitars. I have inquired the prices and they are indeed in the price range mentioned above (the older the cheaper)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 21:15:08
 
RobJe

 

Posts: 731
Joined: Dec. 16 2006
From: UK

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
quote:

the older the cheaper


The 60's guitars had various internal bracing patterns and I have found them to be rather different to the later guitars. Something like the final pattern emerged during the 70s.

If you look under the "sold" tab at Kent Guitars you will see more examples.

You will often see a UK advertisement claiming that the Reyes belonged to Pepe Martínez. Pepe travelled to the UK every year from the late 50's until about 1980 giving formal and informal concerts. He championed the guitars of Reyes and frequently brought one or more over for his many UK students and friends. Sometimes he left his beloved Barbero back in Spain and played his concerts on one of the sold guitars before handing it over.

Rob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 22:13:35
 
Echi

 

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
I completely agree with Ricardo.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2019 22:38:48
 
JasonM

Posts: 2054
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Echi) 
quote:

Conde’s seemed to be the standard throughout the 90’s into early 2000’s, however I noticed the shift, and this is my personal view, due to Vicente and Tomatito always using them


Seems like I see many players not using their Condes as of late. Vicente was like the only weird kid without a Conde, now guys are using all kinds of guitars - Reyes, Jeromimo Perez, barba or whomever. Maybe for a change of sound I don’t know. Now once again Vicente is being the different guy and playing a Francisco Navarro lol
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2019 2:14:05
 
sartorius

Posts: 206
Joined: Mar. 7 2017
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
Vicente's 2003 Lester Devoe is currently for sale here:


https://www.flamencoguitarsforsale.net/guitarras-lester-devoe/guitarra-flamenca-lester-devoe-2003-vicente-amigo/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2019 6:22:03
 
Echi

 

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Carlos_ffm) 
quote:

Seems like I see many players not using their Condes as of late.
Vicente was like the only weird kid without a Conde, now guys are using all kinds of guitars - Reyes, Jeromimo Perez, barba or whomever. Maybe for a change of sound I don’t know. Now once again Vicente is being the different guy and playing a Francisco Navarro
.
A Reyes makes a lot of sense in the hands of Amigo because he has such a distinctive style.
I think also that he needed a guitar better fit to support his lyrical way to play, particularly on the trebles ..Tomatito and Antonio Rey just followed Vicente’s track.
There are still so many pro-players playing Conde around: Diego del Morao, Chicuelo, Jeronimo Maya, Riqueni, Jesus Guerrero etc.
Jeronimo Perez, Pena Vargas and Sanchis at the end of the day are Conde-like guitars. Good guitars, but probably the reason they are so well spread is because they are cheaper than Conde or these makers are more willing to endorse pro-players.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 11 2019 12:57:43
 
Tom Blackshear

 

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008
 

RE: How much would you buy a Reyes f... (in reply to Echi) 
quote:

Sanchis


I actually had the opportunity to play a Philipe V and a Sanchis side by side and I have to say the Sanchis was a batter instrument. This was back in 2001.

This was an independent testing but I gather that sometimes guitar copies are somewhat better than the originals.

_____________________________

Tom Blackshear Guitar maker
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 11 2019 20:27:13
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