Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machines, your recomendation

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pundi64

Posts: 234
Joined: Jul. 29 2016
From: Thailand

Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machines,...

In your opinion what are some fine tuners to put a Flamenco guitar aftermarket.
I agree to what has been said in here, if you looking for pretty jewelry to hang on your
guitar, you will pay the price, high end, for a nice looking, very functional
tuner, with out the big name , like Rogers, Allessi, Baljak, Sloane, Rubner, etc, there are
Very nice DE Jung tuners that'll give you good service.
First pic is a Cordoba Premium, 2nd De Jung, Alice, etc, I'm sort of leaning towards the De Jung's myself
These can be bought from $12.00 to $79.00

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 7 2016 21:20:43

VAHE

Posts: 82
Joined: Sep. 25 2014
From: ARMENIAN (living in U.S.)

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

TRY ALESSI TUNERS ITS HAND MADE IN ITALY . ABOUT $600.00

ON THE LOWER END TRY RUBNER TUNERS THE HIGHER END. ABOUT $200.00

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 5:30:28

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

You can have Alessi for less. In Italy they are sold at 350 euro and there are a lot of options.
Very good are also M&M (handmade in Italy) and Exagon tuning machines.
Paco used a good model of Gotoh (130 euro) and they are very smooth.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 8:49:09

Stephen Eden

Posts: 914
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

I've been a bit disappointed with the Alessi I recently received. I bought 3 different models not cheap ones either. All of the post holders have fairly bad pitting as if the casting went wrong but the used them any way. not what you want in a £400 set of tuners. this was on all three sets and 2 different types of metal too.

M&M tuners are great if you can get hold of him. I've sent him 5 or 6 emails lately and have heard nothing back from him.

Gotoh seem to consistently meet high standards in their premium range and even in the lower end tuners. So I think I will be using those until my partner Sabrina learns how to make them!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 11:02:22

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Stephen Eden)

If Gotoh would make a premium tuner with a lyre and Spanish appearance, similar to the Fustero machines, I would buy them, as they are a good working machine.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 11:48:24

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

Tom, Gotoh recently introduced a lyra model very similar to Fustero. I saw them in Maditer.
Alessi still makes everything by hand and when he is under pressure with the orders can be a little less accurate than usual.
When this happened he always was available to apologise and replace the tuners for what it worths.
Generally speaking I find him quite consistent though.
M&M is a very small company based in Treviso, Italy. The production of tuners is a very small part of their business. If you want I can make them a buzz.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 13:09:31

Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

quote:

M&M is a very small company based in Treviso, Italy. The production of tuners is a very small part of their business. If you want I can make them a buzz.

When I'm building houses I always shrug when clients begin purchasing products from Italy. They always take a lifetime to get here opposed to any other European country......rivaled maybe by Spain.....

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 14:04:56

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Echi)

quote:

Tom, Gotoh recently introduced a lyra model very similar to Fustero.

Thanks For the thought but I'm still able to purchase Fusteros in Spain. For small quantities and strictly as a personal favor, right now. I don't know how long it will last.

He is closed to the market, as far as I know.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 14:33:56

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

I like the appearance of the Fusteros more than anything else (I actually have a couple of top of the line sets) but I sadly have to admit that they are not as smooth and reliable as Gotoh, Alessi etc.
Fustero now is regularly working as before being just more expensive.
I was told by a Spanish friend that Fustero makes anyway a very good price for the Spanish makers and therefore still sells quite well.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 8 2016 22:56:59

Stephen Eden

Posts: 914
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

I've used 3 sets of Fusteros so far and I really don't think they are much to be rated. The term shiney and bright comes to mind.

If I was pulling the same money as you Tom for my guitars I would be using Rodgers or Graf.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 9 2016 10:11:04

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Stephen Eden)

quote:

If I was pulling the same money as you Tom for my guitars I would be using Rodgers or Graf.

I hear you and I have used them before but I like the Fustero motif better as it is characteristically a Spanish machine.

Even Gotoh is a good working machine but it's not quite the motif I'm looking for. But if someone wants me to use what you suggest, then I'm open to accept it, as long as they provide the machine so I don't have to special order it.

Also, price differences are not accepted against any guitar order.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 9 2016 13:04:40

Ricardo

Posts: 14818
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

Bought these off of a Japanese site, decent price in December. 35G3600T two tone finish.

http://www.foroflamenco.com/upfiles/313/Ki19506.jpeg

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 9 2016 17:57:02

jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Tom Blackshear)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Blackshear

Even Gotoh is a good working machine but it's not quite the motif I'm looking for. But if someone wants me to use what you suggest, then I'm open to accept it, as long as they provide the machine so I don't have to special order it.

I used to buy the same Gotoh's that now cost $72 at Stewmac for $11, at that time they were making some really fancy tuners with inlayed abalone that sold for $140. I looked at a set and they were exactly the same $11 tuners with fancy touches. Gotoh's were all we used for many years but the price just kept creeping up with no change in quality.

A few years ago we came across Der Jung tuners from Taiwan. The high end ones are very similar to Gotoh although maybe not quite as smooth but the bulk price is very competitive. I can throw away any set that seems a little rough and still save money. Tuners are basically a worm drive like is found in many power tools. If I can buy a drill for $50 that will last for years at high rates of speed why are tuners so expensive? I say they are all a rip off. A really good set should sell for $10-$20.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 9 2016 23:14:47

Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

I think it's because the worm drive on my skil saw and drill don't have to be decorative. None the less, I'm sure it's just a simple case of supply and demand. Power tools are pumped out by the billions, tuners not so much I'm sure.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2016 3:28:24

Stephen Eden

Posts: 914
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

It's more of a quality thing John. The high end, hand made tuners are such a lovely thing to put on your guitars. The £10 tuners not so much.

There is also a substantial difference in the quality from the regular £50 Gotoh to the Premium Gotoh. Not just in the gearing but the quality of the entire product.

Der Jungs retail prices just seem way to high for what you get. I have been given a set that apparently cost £250. They seem of the same quality as the £20 Der Jungs. Just using MOP buttons and Abalone inlays

The worm drives on power tools don't have to have as High tolerances perhaps? I'm not sure which power tools have worms in though so I can't be sure.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2016 8:13:04

Escribano

Posts: 6415
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

A shout out for Schaller. I installed the black button version on my Bernal many years ago and they have been fine.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2016 8:59:46

jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Stephen Eden)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SEden

Der Jungs retail prices just seem way to high for what you get. I have been given a set that apparently cost £250. They seem of the same quality as the £20 Der Jungs. Just using MOP buttons and Abalone inlays

That was the case with Gotoh's years ago. I haven't used any high end Gotoh's recently so can't comment on current quality difference.

quote:

The worm drives on power tools don't have to have as High tolerances perhaps? I'm not sure which power tools have worms in though so I can't be sure.

Only drills with a 90 degree bend have worm drives. I have an old worm drive power saw that I have worked to death and it still functions flawlessly. I suspect the worm drives on power tools are built to higher tolerances and with better materials to withstand the punishment they take and literally millions of revolutions. One big difference of course is most power tools have bearings instead of cheap pot metal bushings like tuners.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2016 14:09:59

SephardRick

Posts: 358
Joined: Apr. 11 2014

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Ricardo)

Ricardo,

I've been looking for a pair of 35G600T. I love the two-tone metal, red knobs, and cherub stampings.

The only source I've found is:

http://g-jax.com/510/35g3600t.html

Is that were you got yours?

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Rick

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 11 2016 14:13:24

RobJe

Posts: 731
Joined: Dec. 16 2006
From: UK

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to SephardRick)

quote:

I love the two-tone metal, red knobs, and cherub stampings.

Well, who doesn't - but if you start to pay serious money it is worth getting 1:18 or 1:18 rather than 1:14 ratio. Both can be seen in the pictures posted so far.

Then there is also the first law of tuners. If you are thinking of tuners that cost more than 5% of the current value of your guitar you should get a new guitar instead.

Rob

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 11 2016 15:07:16

Ricardo

Posts: 14818
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to SephardRick)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SephardRick

Ricardo,

I've been looking for a pair of 35G600T. I love the two-tone metal, red knobs, and cherub stampings.

The only source I've found is:

http://g-jax.com/510/35g3600t.html

Is that were you got yours?

That's the place. You can customize the color and style.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 11 2016 18:20:54

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to SephardRick)

quote:

I've been looking for a pair of 35G600T. I love the two-tone metal, red knobs, and cherub stampings.

I think the machine would have wider appeal for the Japanese maker to stay with a neutral style rather than try to emulate universal appeal with a spiritual image on their machines.

I'm not against spiritual things, just images on my machines. I would love to see that style be toward a more Spanish motif with MOP oval tuning buttons. AT THE PRICE THEY QUOTE, I'd buy them in a New York minute.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 12 2016 12:27:13

Ricardo

Posts: 14818
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to Tom Blackshear)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tom Blackshear

quote:

I've been looking for a pair of 35G600T. I love the two-tone metal, red knobs, and cherub stampings.

I think the machine would have wider appeal for the Japanese maker to stay with a neutral style rather than try to emulate universal appeal with a spiritual image on their machines.

I'm not against spiritual things, just images on my machines. I would love to see that style be toward a more Spanish motif with MOP oval tuning buttons. AT THE PRICE THEY QUOTE, I'd buy them in a New York minute.

More like these with the 2W or 2M option?
http://g-jax.com/510/machine-heads/classic-guitar-tuner/35g1600.html

$84 !!! They make them custom to your order so it takes a couple weeks but I was very satisfied.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 12 2016 20:16:47

pundi64

Posts: 234
Joined: Jul. 29 2016
From: Thailand

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

Here is what I bought yesterday a Rubner. All other pics in this thread are nice, there so many to choose from makes a guy crazy looking.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 12 2016 22:19:22

pundi64

Posts: 234
Joined: Jul. 29 2016
From: Thailand

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to SephardRick)

OK looks good, but who makes them is the big question?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 19 2016 19:51:46

SephardRick

Posts: 358
Joined: Apr. 11 2014

RE: Mechanical Flamenco Tuning machi... (in reply to pundi64)

Dan,

The 35G600T tuners are made by Gotoh. Here is a link to the manufacture:

http://g-gotoh.com/international/product/35g3600t.html

They also have more politically correct patterns to please guys like Tom.

By the way, I wrote to Gotoh for a US source. They recommend JAPARTS.ca. out of Vancouver, BC. From there I got a quote of $74.17, plus $22.99 freight for a total of $97.16 delivered to Louisiana. Sorry, Ricardo! Transaction are via PayPal. Thus making a secure transaction.

So, I have a pair on the way with a lead time of two to four weeks. I just hope my Vicente Sanchis looks half as good as Ricardo's photo with the new tuners.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 19 2016 19:59:13