paduk is driving me crazy

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Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

paduk is driving me crazy

guys
I'm working on 2 paduk sides ,they are too stiff and very hard to bend they also had cracks while I was trying to bend them,this may be because they are 3 mm thick, I'm using a mold with heat gun.
what should I do for this?!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 29 2015 20:46:37

Jeff Highland

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

-Bend at 2mm
-Get a proper bending iron, the heat gun with it's high air flow will be drying the timber too much

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 29 2015 21:31:18

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Jeff Highland)

quote:

the heat gun with it's high air flow will be drying the timber too much

can I use it but a bit away from the wood?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 29 2015 22:13:59

Jeff Highland

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

You can do whatever you want but it is a really, really bad way to do it.
Moving the gun further away will not help.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 29 2015 22:30:53

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Jeff Highland)

I got the idea from this video

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 29 2015 22:49:26

Jeff Highland

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

There is a lot of garbage on Youtube. You are wasting your time and materials with this method.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 29 2015 22:57:46

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Jeff Highland)

anyway,can I make a good use of this mold?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 30 2015 8:15:50

Jeff Highland

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

It would work with a lightbulb (incandescent) heat source

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 30 2015 9:07:43

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Jeff Highland)

quote:

It would work with a lightbulb (incandescent) heat source

how would be the setup?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 30 2015 11:08:24

Jeff Highland

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

I don't do it that way, I use a heating blanket, but search for "fox bender"

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 30 2015 11:21:25

Stephen Eden

Posts: 914
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

Ahmed use your heat gun to heat the inside of a metal pole. That will help you bend better. There are plenty of examples of this on YT.

Also use 2mm sides! at the right tempreture it well bend like butter

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Classical and Flamenco Guitars www.EdenGuitars.co.uk

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 30 2015 13:57:48

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Stephen Eden)

quote:

Ahmed use your heat gun to heat the inside of a metal pole.

how is this?

quote:

There are plenty of examples of this on YT

do you have the link?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 30 2015 21:02:59

Andy Culpepper

Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

Yep don't think it's possible to bend at 3mm. I thin out my sides until I can hold them in the middle and get the "right amount" of flap when I shake them back and forth. It's fun to do and you get the right thickness literally every time. For reference I usually get about

1.8 or 1.9 Cypress
2.0 Indian Rosewood and Padauk
2.25 Maple

_____________________________

Andy Culpepper, luthier
http://www.andyculpepper.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 0:19:15

constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1677
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

Yes, as you've been told, 3 mm is too thick to bend. I make sides 1/16" thick which is 1.59 mm. Luckily, there are commonly available circular saw blades this thickness that can be used for cutting the slots in the neck that the sides will go into.

_____________________________

Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 5:54:22

Stephen Eden

Posts: 914
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

I don't know where Ahmed I have been shown some in the past where guys have used blow torches and such to achieve the same thing.

I bought an Ibex bender.

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Classical and Flamenco Guitars www.EdenGuitars.co.uk

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 11:53:21

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Andy, Ethan
using heat gun is wrong?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 13:00:49

Stephen Eden

Posts: 914
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

Lol ok not that I really have time to run around for you but here it is a heat gun bending iron. 2 minutes on google and I found this a few more minutes and I'm sure you could find 20 more of these!

You will not get a good heat distribution across and through the side just using a gun. Plus the risk of setting fire to your sides surely must go up!

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Classical and Flamenco Guitars www.EdenGuitars.co.uk

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 13:12:23

constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1677
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

I've never tried using a heat gun. Nothing is wrong if it works.

How I tell if my bending iron is hot enough: I drip water on it and the drops boil off immediately.

_____________________________

Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 14:41:59

Jeff Highland

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

Yep, pancake pan temperature.

Wood bends best with some moisture in it (but not too much especially on curly wood) and this moisture would be swiftly removed by direct airflow from a heat gun.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 22:28:55

Andy Culpepper

Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

If you search around online you can find clever and cheap bending iron setups, I know you can use a toaster element or even light bulbs.

The hotter the better up to about 400F or so, above that you will get scorching on lighter woods. I can always tell it's hot enough when the wood "gives up" and lets me bend the waist easily. And a spritz of water helps a lot (do it on both sides for tighter bends).

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http://www.andyculpepper.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 31 2015 23:41:15

estebanana

Posts: 9352
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

Put two pieces of burning charcoal in a tube clamped in vice.

Bending iron, old Spanish style. Or Italian or whatever.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 1 2015 0:44:03

constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1677
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to estebanana)

quote:

Put two pieces of burning charcoal in a tube clamped in vice.

Bending iron, old Spanish style. Or Italian or whatever.

Have good ventilation to avoid carbon monoxide poisoning!

_____________________________

Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 1 2015 1:43:52

keith

Posts: 1108
Joined: Sep. 29 2009
From: Back in Boston

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

I noticed no one suggested Irving Sloane's method of putting wood into heated water to get it pliable enough to bend. Is this method dead?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 2 2015 22:19:14

jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005

RE: paduk is driving me crazy (in reply to keith)

quote:

ORIGINAL: keith

I noticed no one suggested Irving Sloane's method of putting wood into heated water to get it pliable enough to bend. Is this method dead?

The problem with that method is it results in buckling. The sides rarely stay flat when you put them on the form to dry. A old fashioned bending iron is by far the easiest and safest way to bend sides however there is a learning curve involved. One needs to learn how to set the temperature, etc. I've used a propane torch heated homemade bending iron for about 50 years and wouldn't even consider anything else.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 2 2015 22:52:44