Fretless Flamenco Guitar

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constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1674
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

Fretless Flamenco Guitar

I stuck this in the last post as an edit, so in case no one noticed:

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Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 4 2015 3:51:15

Ahmed Flamenco

Posts: 163
Joined: Feb. 22 2014
From: Egypt

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

It sounds as if it is a Turkish oud

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 4 2015 11:01:49

timoteo

Posts: 219
Joined: Jun. 22 2012
From: Seattle, USA

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to Ahmed Flamenco)

I saw a fretless guitar by German Vazquez Rubio for sale on eBay a few years ago. It was beautiful. I watched the listing for several months, but it didn't sell even after the price was cut. The owner then had frets put on, listed it again, and eventually sold it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 4 2015 20:09:50

tele

Posts: 1464
Joined: Aug. 17 2012

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Very nice

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 4 2015 20:58:02

El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

thats going straight on my faves list .. love the sound of fretless stuff ..great for putting extra expression in ...

Although the begining was better than when the tempo picked up as it also became more ..folky ... never mind /...

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 4 2015 21:48:28

milanlondons

Posts: 34
Joined: Jan. 9 2015

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

I had an Eighties Ricardo Sanchis Carpio classical that had been modified into a fretless. I eventually sold it because the tecnique was too different from a standard fretted guitar but it was truly an intoxicating instrument. If you find one I suggest that you try it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 4 2015 21:48:35

estebanana

Posts: 9351
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

I tried to add that guy as a friend on facebook but it said he had reached his friends limit!

He has 4600 watchers..he's great.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 5 2015 2:31:21

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Very good stuff. Thanks for sharing.
I admit I was a little closed minded when I read the thread title, as the fretless guitars sound too distinctive to my ear probably because of the different transient of the note (like an oud etc.), but actually the guy there was able to use this characteristic very well.
His style reminds me a little Myrrdim's.
If I had to play a frettless guitar probably I'd go for a Kohno cedar with lowered action: I have an old Kohno which is impressive for the sustain of the note. Maybe, if it was not fretted, the note would grow slowly and more sustained, more like a cello.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 5 2015 10:02:09

bernd

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb. 15 2004

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

In the 90th years there was a Polish or Czech guitar maker of steel string guitars who made a fretless nylon string guitar with a pickup. I had the oppertunity to check it. On such a guitar you have access to all microtonal intervals, but that wasn´t my thing at all. I totally didn´t like it, and I don´t like the guitar in the video above but I agree with Ahmed that it sounds like turkish oud; not really a guitar.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 5 2015 21:07:15

Sr. Martins

Posts: 3077
Joined: Apr. 4 2011

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

For those who want to enjoy playing fretless with the added bonus of having a different instrument that is easier to control intonation-wise (because of scale lenght), I would recommend getting an electric fretless bass.

It's fun to play, gives you new musical ideas to explore and it's a useful complement to your guitar recordings.

Remember that there's more to bass tone than the flamenco fart on the upper octave.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 6 2015 0:28:48

flamencoLVR

Posts: 26
Joined: Apr. 27 2015

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Wonder what Jerry Douglas might do with a fretless?

quote:

ORIGINAL: constructordeguitarras

I stuck this in the last post as an edit, so in case no one noticed:

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 3 2015 1:34:44

Jim Kirby

Posts: 149
Joined: Jul. 14 2011
From: Newark, DE, USA

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to flamencoLVR)

quote:

ORIGINAL: flamencoLVR

Wonder what Jerry Douglas might do with a fretless?

This just beggars the imagination!

Seems like a bad angle for rasqueado, though?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 3 2015 16:41:57

norumba2

Posts: 37
Joined: May 20 2015

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

i agree with El Kiko, it was much more compelling before he put the groove to it.

fascinating.... i play fretless electric guitar and oud, but had never thought of a fretless acoustic. this gives me a lot of ideas...

constructordeguitarras , did you make the instrument?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2015 17:24:27

constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1674
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to norumba2)

No, I haven't made any fretless guitars.

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Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2015 20:04:30

MunichLuthier

Posts: 18
Joined: May 12 2015

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Wow, this is touching! Beautiful by its own way!

Thank you for sharing!

Michael

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2015 21:10:42

rombsix

Posts: 7807
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to MunichLuthier)

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Ramzi

http://www.youtube.com/rombsix

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 25 2016 6:49:49

Piwin

Posts: 3559
Joined: Feb. 9 2016

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Necropost:

Is there anything inherent to a fretless guitar that would make it a bad call for flamenco?
All I could come up with is that it would make certain things incredibly hard (for instance, I'm pretty sure when I'm holding a barré I move the finger around a bit if there are certain stretches involved, which would slide me out of tune on a fretless). And I seem to recall some players of bowed instruments telling me that chords (pretty much the basis for guitar) are very difficult on their own instruments.
It would also affect the sound of any sequence of notes played with the same finger on the same string (but that's overall not all that common).
Are there other factors I'm not considering? Maybe having just the finger and no fret would affect sustain?
Anyways, just curious.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 26 2018 15:03:24

kitarist

Posts: 1715
Joined: Dec. 4 2012

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to Piwin)

I think you pretty much listed all of the major shortcomings. I can't think of anything else but all this is plenty enough to make it impossible to play flamenco (or classical) properly on a fretless guitar.

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Konstantin

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 26 2018 17:19:03

Ricardo

Posts: 14799
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to Piwin)

How about you can’t play ANY FREAKING CHORDS!!!!! The basis of flamenco and the whole point of using a guitar for accompaniment. And one more thing.... NO CHORDS AT ALL!!!!!! And finally, you can’t play chords.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 26 2018 17:42:33

Piwin

Posts: 3559
Joined: Feb. 9 2016

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to Ricardo)

lol thanks guys. I've never tried a fretless anything so I guess I'm underestimating how hard it is to play chords.
And now I know why fretless bass is a thing, and fretless acoustic guitar isn't.

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 26 2018 18:06:15

JasonM

Posts: 2054
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to Piwin)

Thought the whole point of having no frets was so you can bow the strings. Which we don’t do on the guitar unless your playing Dazed and Confused

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 26 2018 23:51:52

Flamingrae

Posts: 220
Joined: May 19 2009

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

I really enjoyed this to the point I have a turd guitar with a fretboard about to be fitted and I'm thinking just not put frets on it for the sheer hell of it. (then put the frets on when I have satisfied my urges!!) I also think that it will take some practise to get a feel for the landscape of the board. That said, if they can make chords on a three string viola in Eastern European gypsy music, why not? Ultimately I don't think it will ever replace the trad flamenco guitar as it is so disciplined and as said the barre may prove problematic. I love the oud feel it gives though and well worth a watch. One to bring out half way through a set for a bit of variety?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 26 2018 23:53:41

El Burdo

Posts: 632
Joined: Sep. 8 2011

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

Yeah, that'll work. Pizzicato flamenco. Different.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 27 2018 14:12:08

aaron peacock

Posts: 141
Joined: Apr. 26 2020
From: Portugal

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to constructordeguitarras)

You can play chords all right.

1) try some open tunings
2) barring works great, vertical placement with A/I/M not so great.... see #1, LOL

also, think of how much of Sabicas etc is single note or double-stop (easy) falsetas above a bassline that's often just alternating A and E string. (either a 4th or a 5th, depending upon who is the tonic)

I think people tend to presume that only a monophonic concept will work with a fretless, but check this folk guy, undoubtedly with some open tuning...

So then, you just need to own about a half-dozen fretless guitars each with their own tuning and with a guitar rack and your armada you are set for a nights show :D
great business for the luthiers methinks :D

(or this is where one of Ricardos many roadies tunes his bespoke luthier fretless for him while he plays a fretted song.)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 28 2020 14:36:38

constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1674
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to aaron peacock)

Nice!

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Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 29 2020 3:06:06

JasonM

Posts: 2054
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: Fretless Flamenco Guitar (in reply to aaron peacock)

I got to play a fretless flamenco guitar a couple months ago owned by Cenk Erdogan.., this guitar https://youtu.be/_CHBZAu5rG4

What surprised me is that even though I had my fingers in the right locations for a chord the intonation was still off. You’ve got to push and pull the strings just right or be spot on in your placement.

Cenk would would move my finger over by just 1mm to fix a note. Amazing how he could know such accuracy.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Apr. 29 2020 15:50:07