"Conde Style" guitars by Marlon Navarro?!

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Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

"Conde Style" guitars by M...

Anyone tried one of these?

great price for sure and you can even make offers ;)

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Conde-Hermanos-Style-Blanca-Flamenco-Guitar-by-Marlon-Navarro-/350745766190?pt=Guitar&hash=item51aa13a92e

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 19 2013 18:54:02

avimuno

Posts: 598
Joined: Feb. 9 2007
From: Paris, France

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

According to Johannes from Mundo Flamenco, this is Francisco Navarro's son... and his guitars are supposed to be really nice!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 19 2013 20:22:58

Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to avimuno)

quote:

ORIGINAL: avimuno

According to Johannes from Mundo Flamenco, this is Francisco Navarro's son... and his guitars are supposed to be really nice!

thanks, yes i know he is Francisco's Son (its also mentioned in the subtitle of the ebay listing), just wanted to know if anyone played one of these "Conde Style" guitars, since there is also mentioned "Non-Production Model - Custom Built In Small Quanitites By Special Order"

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 19 2013 20:24:43

avimuno

Posts: 598
Joined: Feb. 9 2007
From: Paris, France

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

This is his "Reyes" model... sounds pretty good!! I'm sure this "Conde style" is also pretty good.. at this price you might as well give it a try!

http://mundo-flamenco.com/en/gitarren-neu/358-2900-marlon-t-navarro-alvarez-zypressefichte-2013

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 19 2013 21:04:40

tele

Posts: 1464
Joined: Aug. 17 2012

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to avimuno)

quote:

ORIGINAL: avimuno

This is his "Reyes" model... sounds pretty good!! I'm sure this "Conde style" is also pretty good.. at this price you might as well give it a try!

http://mundo-flamenco.com/en/gitarren-neu/358-2900-marlon-t-navarro-alvarez-zypressefichte-2013

3k for a guitar that is a sort of copy of another maker... I for one would never pay that money just out of the idea.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 19 2013 21:28:03

estebanana

Posts: 9351
Joined: Oct. 16 2009

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

Media Lunacy.

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https://www.stephenfaulkguitars.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 0:41:10

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

Anyone tried one of these?
great price for sure and you can even make offers ;)

The seller isn't Ron Hudson from Texas!

This person (even though located in Texas) is a different Seller!

I believe this is the SAME guitar I purchased last Summer! I had to returned it and lost 15 percent of money!

The guitar came to me with a medium to high action! I took it to my luthier (TRUSTWORTHY) who could not lower the action! The neck was NOT angeled correctly from the beginning.

Unless you are willing to reset the neck, I would stay away from this.

The Seller has tried selling this guitar for $1050.00, $950.00, $850.00 and now $750.00?

I remember when speaking to the Seller, he told me that this guitar had the famous Conde bracing and that Fransico himself fined tuned it, yeah, right

It is a Student Model and sound like one at best!

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 2:41:06

tri7/5

Posts: 570
Joined: May 5 2012

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalo

The guitar came to me with a medium to high action!

The Navarro camp seems to be hit and miss on the setup at times, even on their higher end models.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 12:19:36

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

The Navarro camp seems to be hit and miss on the setup at times, even on their higher end models.

A friend of mine went down to Parracho, and purchased the Grande Reyes Model for $1800.00

When the guitar arrived, it too came with a high action that was due to the neck being "bent".

He had to bring down to Tucson to a prominent luthier who had to re set the neck.

Not all Navarro guitars are like this, but, it seems to be semi common problem.

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 13:57:07

Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

hmm, i am more than happy with my sanchis, was thinking about buying one of these as an additional side guitar just to see how it does as a "conde copy".
But bowed neck and no way to lower setup? no way. sudden humidity changes maybe? don't know.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 17:06:11

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

hmm, i am more than happy with my sanchis, was thinking about buying one of these as an additional side guitar just to see how it does as a "conde copy".
But bowed neck and no way to lower setup? no way. sudden humidity changes maybe? don't know.

The only thing cool about this STUDENT MODEL is the Conde look!

It in no way sounds like Conde! It sounds like all his Student Model.

I would think your Sanchis probably plays and sounds way better

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 17:11:49

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to tele)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tele

quote:

ORIGINAL: avimuno

This is his "Reyes" model... sounds pretty good!! I'm sure this "Conde style" is also pretty good.. at this price you might as well give it a try!

http://mundo-flamenco.com/en/gitarren-neu/358-2900-marlon-t-navarro-alvarez-zypressefichte-2013

3k for a guitar that is a sort of copy of another maker... I for one would never pay that money just out of the idea.

My understanding is that Francisco Navarro, has, or is cutting a deal with Vicente Amigo to sell his Reyes style flamenco guitars in Spain, possibly in some of the European countries, but not sure about the wider sales areas yet.

It all started with Francisco learning how to build a copy and produce it through Memorial Music in Houston Texas...owner is Ron Hudson. And Ron is probably still the distributor, world wide, for this venture....and it makes sense that Francisco's son, Marlon, would have to help with the construction phase, whether or not he would have his name on the label.

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 19:46:41

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

quote:

I would think your Sanchis probably plays and sounds way better

I would agree with this since the Sanchis factory has been building guitars for Conde for quite some time....and this goes for other factories in Spain, as well.

Sanchis is not the only subcontractor for Conde, as far as I know.

But I give Francisco Navarro a fair amount of praise for his Reyes style. And Vicente Amigo seems to really like them.

http://tomblackshearguitarbuilder.weebly.com/vincente-navarro.html

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 20:02:26

Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Tom Blackshear)

Yes, my point wasn't to compare this to Sanchis, just if it sounds and plays anywhere near a conde student guitar (such as EF5) or not even that.
you surely don't want to buy a "conde style" guitar and find out that the only similarity is the half moon headstock or media lunacy as stephen stated ;)

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 20:16:54

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arash

Yes, my point wasn't to compare this to Sanchis, just if it sounds and plays anywhere near a conde student guitar (such as EF5) or not even that.
you surely don't want to buy a "conde style" guitar and find out that the only similarity is the half moon headstock or media lunacy as stephen stated ;)

Well, I agree but then we go a little further to decide what Conde pattern we are referring to. Faustino, Conde apprentices, the newer Conde style, which is a far cry from Faustino's work, or what...?

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 20:22:43

Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Tom Blackshear)

Well anything that sounds and feels anywhere near a conde (no matter which one) as stated.

Kalo's experience seams to be that they have nothing in common with any Conde whatsoever

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 20:41:05

Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalo

I believe this is the SAME guitar I purchased last Summer! I had to returned it and lost 15 percent of money!

The Seller has tried selling this guitar for $1050.00, $950.00, $850.00 and now $750.00?

Kalo

ok i checked the feedback of this seller and he seams to have sold quite a number of these (also "conde style" negras) during the past few months.
So its not only one guitar, he seams to have tons of them ;)
So maybe others don't have the neck problem you mention. i don't know.
But all in all i guess its maybe not a good idea.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 20:46:46

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

Hey Arash,

Just to let you know, that these guitars are Student Models!!

I just think its funny how the SAME seller sold this guitar for $1050.00 and it has come down to $750.00

Last year, when I purchased this guitar, it was going for $950.00!

Again, this is a student model Fransico Navarro that was made to look like a Conde, but, not sound like one..

It might be worth a chance to take if you are in the market for a student model...

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 21:40:39

flyhere

Posts: 121
Joined: Dec. 17 2012

[Deleted]

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Dec. 18 2013 3:24:39

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 20 2013 23:32:29

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

A student model for $750? too much money for me! Wonder how it compares to a Yamaha 171/172 for about $350. At the $1050 price range, I would rather save a bit more and get a used Hms Sanchis.

To be honest if one went down to Parracho and to Fransico's shop you can purchase any of his guitars for HALF of what most distributors in the U.S. sell them for.

As for how the student flamenco fares against a yamaha...

They are made better, but, they don't sound better than quality flamenco guitar.

However, I might be a little biased since the second Navarro didn't work out for me.

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 0:33:39

keith

Posts: 1108
Joined: Sep. 29 2009
From: Back in Boston

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

kalo, interesting point about traveling to mexico although the cost of travel as well as armed security might increase the cost greater than one shipped to texas.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 15:39:27

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

kalo, interesting point about traveling to mexico although the cost of travel as well as armed security might increase the cost greater than one shipped to texas.

Keith, you 've have point

I guess, I feel it is a TAD unfair, that anyone can go to Parracho and buy any Franisco Navarro guitar for 1/2 the price and mark them up and sell them out of their house!

People are saying how bad Mexico is right now, however, the two guitarist that I know go down to Parracho all the time! They do not have any problems whatsoever.

Even my friends go to Rocky Pointe and spend the weekend there without much problems.

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 15:48:37

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalo

quote:

kalo, interesting point about traveling to mexico although the cost of travel as well as armed security might increase the cost greater than one shipped to texas.

Keith, you 've have point

I guess, I feel it is a TAD unfair, that anyone can go to Parracho and buy any Franisco Navarro guitar for 1/2 the price and mark them up and sell them out of their house!

Not anyone can go to Paracho Mexico and buy a Navarro guitar, its not an everyday deal but some professionals, on occasion, will buy direct from Poncho.

However, Memorial Music in Houston Texas has an exclusive contract with Poncho, for some 20 years now. And I just heard that Vicente Amigo is now in Portugal playing a Navarro.

There is something of an agreement for Poncho to make a guitar line for Vicente to sell.

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 16:47:58

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

Really, two of my so called flamenco buddies aren't professionals at all..

I am not trying to stir controversy!

I know business is business!

My friend who is a hobbist had no problem buying a Reyes for $1800.00!

He even told me I should go down to Mexico for the ride with a couple of my friends and visit Navarro's shop.

The same person also visited Castillo's Shop and tried to buy one of his models at discount and Castillo said NO!!!!

It's great that Vincente is now endorsing Reyes Model, I am sure the price will go up LOTS and make more sales!

Kalo

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 16:54:02

tri7/5

Posts: 570
Joined: May 5 2012

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalo

It's great that Vincente is now endorsing Reyes Model, I am sure the price will go up LOTS and make more sales!

This has yet to be seen.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 18:08:31

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

I meant to say that Vicente was not looking to contract with Poncho for a Reyes copy but some other style that Vicente has on his mind.

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 21:52:43

keith

Posts: 1108
Joined: Sep. 29 2009
From: Back in Boston

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Kalo)

kalo--is one of your friends eric holder? i would imagine the man behind fast and furious would have safe travels in mexico given so many of the banditos owe him big time.

if you think about it, the importer of navarro guitars would have to pay to ship the guitars to the states and then make some profit over and beyond his costs of doing business. just imagine what the conde clan are making having guitars made in china then sold as.....

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 22:36:47

Kalo

Posts: 400
Joined: Jan. 25 2011

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

quote:

kalo--is one of your friends eric holder? i would imagine the man behind fast and furious would have safe travels in mexico given so many of the banditos owe him big time.

No Keith, my friend isn't Eric Holder

quote:

if you think about it, the importer of navarro guitars would have to pay to ship the guitars to the states and then make some profit over and beyond his costs of doing business. just imagine what the conde clan are making having guitars made in china then sold as.....

I hear ya, and like I said "business is business" I was in retail once and used to do pricing for professional audio/video.

I didn't know the Conde clan are making guitars made in China

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 21 2013 23:01:26

maltess

Posts: 17
Joined: May 25 2013

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to Arash)

I dont like the fact of style imitation, so many guitars brands to choose from without that imitation look

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 28 2013 13:07:58

Tom Blackshear

Posts: 2304
Joined: Apr. 15 2008

RE: "Conde Style" guitars ... (in reply to maltess)

quote:

I dont like the fact of style imitation, so many guitars brands to choose from without that imitation look

I think there will always be replicas made of popular guitar styles. I found my own ideal with the Manuel Reyes style, and although not a slavish copy, I believe the pattern speaks to me as something that I can emulate closely without having to call it a Reyes copy in all of its traits.

The market will always go for what sells and the masters guitars will always have value for reproduction. The question is: can we reproduce a quality model on a consistent basis? I think the answer is yes. So the masters will set the precedent and the replicas will follow.

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Tom Blackshear Guitar maker

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2016 17:35:08