RE: Building Guitar Number 100.

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>Lutherie >>

Page: << < 1 2 [3] 4 5 > >>

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Its a difficult question to answer. But on a classical guitar you look for more tension on the top. That the top is more controlled. When you use a system where the central braces have more angle, you get more cross grain stiffness and more tension on the top. It gets less floppy so to say.
A thing that I forgot to write is that the braces going along the grain, the center braces, being 5, 6 or 7, more or less angle, more or less flamenco or classical are there first of all to avoid that the tension of the string will make the soundboard warp. This you can see very clearly on a guitar with to light a bracing or/and to thin a top. Then the soundboard starts dishing in front of the bridge and lift behind the bridge. So, a very important thing is to get the soundboard and the braces stiff enough, but not more than enough. To much stifness results in poor dynamics and an uncomfortable guitar to play

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 24 2012 21:37:16

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

First of al, thanks for all your replys and encouraging comments

Assembling the guitar

The first two things I do is to join the neck and soundboard and bend the sides in my homemade bending machine:

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (2)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 26 2012 16:57:12

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Next is to start the assembly in the solera.
On the top, you have the sides in the jig, and below you can see the endblock being glued on.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (2)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 8:30:50

Escribano

Posts: 6415
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

quote:

Next is to start the assembly in the solera.

Looking good, Anders. How do you find the 'moulded' jig versus the individual clamps you used before? I imagine that it can give you more uniformity and is perhaps a quicker set-up.

_____________________________

Foro Flamenco founder and Admin

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 8:59:44

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

quote:

I imagine that it can give you more uniformity and is perhaps a quicker set-up.

Exactly.. No need to say more.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 12:28:59

Andy Culpepper

Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

quote:

There are no pictures of the building of the rosette itself. Thats my little secret

I've been trying to figure that out for years..haha (not that I'm going to copy)
It's just awesome how it's all broken but most of the pieces are continuous with each other. I always think of "un terremoto" when I see it.

_____________________________

Andy Culpepper, luthier
http://www.andyculpepper.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 12:55:48

Blair Russell

Posts: 51
Joined: Sep. 6 2012
From: Bristol

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Hah, I like that bending machine. The clamp for the middle bout is a great idea, gonna have to copy it. Do you have to touch up the sides on a bending iron afterwards, or does the machine do the whole process?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 13:10:28

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Blair Russell)

Looks as if Anders has incorporated a heating wire system, of whichs application the "egg timer" shall remind of that is visible in front .

I dig the way he has built his tools.

Ruphus

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 13:40:31

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Ahhh, replys..

The sides of cypress sometimes needs to be touched up on a hot iron. That has nothing to do with my side bender, but cypress has a LOT of springback. Rosewoods dont need to be touched up.

The heater is from a toaster that my dad didnt use. It was 500w, which was to much, so I shortened it some 1/5 or so.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 27 2012 17:14:50

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

After gluing in the tentellones (no photo) I final shape the sides and fit and glue the solid linings. (photo)

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2012 8:09:15

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

While joining the sides to the soundboard and neck, I braced and prepared the back:

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (2)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 29 2012 8:15:48

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

So here´s the guitar ready for the back.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 1 2012 7:51:23

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

gluing the back to the sides.

Here its important not to put to much pressure. Those rubber bands can do harm to a 2mm thick side. Besides. There´s no need for a lot of pressure if you´ve done the preparation well.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 2 2012 8:11:39

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

How come that the linings are so flexible?
( I would had not expected solid strips to be that smooth without damping / expect them to break at such steep bending.)

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 2 2012 11:04:29

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

The linings I have bend in my side bending machine, If not, it would be totally impossible, and as you say, they would break.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 2 2012 13:13:54

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Got it; thank you!

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 2 2012 15:53:31

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

So after that, we get the first real idea of how the guitar will look. Here it is with the edges cleaned and ready for binding and purfling.
oh dear, no picture. Here it should be: (I dont get angry if someone writes that the picture is missing)

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 3 2012 9:05:04

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Preparing for bindings and purflings.

The bindings, I make in my drum sander and the purflings are normally just layers of wood veneer glued together and cut out on the bandsaw. I say normally, because the soundboard of this guitar will have a 1mm thick veneer of bloodwod, that I cut on the bandsaw and finished in the drum sander.

The bindings and the soundboard purflings are bend in my bending machine and the purfling for the back, which is thinner is bent on a hot iron.

The guitar is the having the chanels routed. I make what is callet a staircase, with different heights for the binding and purfling. Here you see the routing for the soundboard:

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (2)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 4 2012 11:12:13

Gimar

Posts: 39
Joined: May 13 2012

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Looks great Anders

what type of glue do you use to glue the veneer to the binding??

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 4 2012 12:57:19

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Now, with the beautiful accuracy of the routing the pics start watering my mouth. And once the necks shaping started, attraction will only increase.
The optics of raw guitars appear so tasty to me; if the finish wasn´t part of the resonating / sonic characteristics, I would had loved to have one just oiled or waxed. ( Eventhough it would be leaving it so susceptible for dings and dangs.)

It´s an irony of my life that I ever since loved working with wood and liked guitars from early on ... and went for a number of professions ( one of which I never even liked, actually hate), but not luthiery.

Guess I need to have my casket built in extra large, so that there be enough room for kicking oneself in the butt.

- Sorry for OT.

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 4 2012 14:27:32

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Gimar)

quote:

what type of glue do you use to glue the veneer to the binding??

The veneer that is glued to the bottom of the bindings before bending is Titebond. I also use Titebond when I glue the bindings and the purflings to the body. I have used hot hide glue (hhg), but it was to stressy and messy. hhg is fantastic and I use it a lot, but on bigger or in this case longer surfaces, I hate its short working time.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 4 2012 15:23:43

Escribano

Posts: 6415
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Ruphus)

quote:

Guess I need to have my casket built in extra large, so that there be enough room for kicking oneself in the butt.

Brilliant. Looks like a copy and paste Americanism

_____________________________

Foro Flamenco founder and Admin

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 4 2012 17:35:43

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Hey, that was my own spontaneous creation!
German mentality isn´t as humorless as the world used to think. These days there are even German comedians touring Canada and the USA, and perceived rather well.
( My personal experience was that my humor was understood in NY, and not so much in California.)

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 5 2012 11:03:39

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Gluing purfling and binding

Here I´m gluing the binding and purfling on the top left. You can glue both sides at a time, but its stressy and messy, so I prefer to take my time.

Below, I´m scraping the binding on the bottom of the guitar. A rubber cloth does that the guitar doesnt slip and that it doesnt hurt.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (2)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 5 2012 15:39:45

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Preparing the fingerboards:

My finger boards are normally around 5,5mm thick. I make tthe sides parallel with the plane and I cut the slots in my homemade gig. It works a thrill and again, mostly made with what I had lying around and what I´ve found. Its a good idea to put a bit of grease on the sides, where the runners are. Just a wee bit.

Next the fingerboard is individually fitted to the guitar. There´s alway a bit to be planed away on the bottom, between the 12th and the 19th fret.

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (2)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 7 2012 7:54:58

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

And then, gluing the fingerboard to the neck and body:

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 7 2012 20:56:39

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anders Eliasson

There´s alway a bit to be planed away on the bottom, between the 12th and the 19th fret.

From the outer surface, to prevent buzzing of notes up the neck, I suppose?
( I havn´t noticed a slope on guitars fretboards, yet. ... Wait, actually I have! Always used to think that was to be a slight dip of the soundboard.)

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2012 10:42:03

Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Nope, You have to plane on the underside of the fretboard. The neck sits in a slight angle and the soundboard might dome a bit. You have to adjust for that.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2012 15:42:25

Jim Kirby

Posts: 149
Joined: Jul. 14 2011
From: Newark, DE, USA

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

Anders,

This is a premier building log. I'm learning so much, unfortunately only catching up every few days or so. Thanks for the thoroughness and the generosity with your experience. My best to you.

Jim

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 9 2012 0:15:02

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: Building Guitar Number 100. (in reply to Anders Eliasson)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anders Eliasson

Nope, You have to plane on the underside of the fretboard. The neck sits in a slight angle and the soundboard might dome a bit. You have to adjust for that.

Got it, gracias!

- So, guess the dip I see every other time to actually be one.

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 9 2012 7:58:29