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RE: Practice and Musicality
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Samarto
Posts: 160
Joined: Mar. 21 2008
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 RE: Practice and Musicality (in reply to Grisha)
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Grisha, I would suggest dedicating a small portion of your practice time to just improvising and having fun without thought of technique. Just use what technique comes naturally. When you play concerts, audiences come to see you play with technical expertise, so give them that and if you feel a little empty afterwards, then in your own privacy play whatever you feel that gives you relief of this emptiness and someday maybe the two will come together. The problem with emotion as it relates to flamenco is everyone feels it different and has different opinions if they felt the right emotion for a certain palo. Rules for compas were established by the flamencos of old, but playing from the heart so to speak was an individual thing and no rules or even guidelines can be established. It is a matter of perception. Everyone has different reference points in history that they identify with certain palos. Compas in itself encompasses a certain amount of emotion. No one can ever know what emotion a solo flamenco guitarist is feeling, except the player. A listener may never hear a difference or if they do may not like it or may love it. One may say it was hot and the other cold. Another point is when you are overfilled with emotion, you say you make technical mistakes. Maybe they aren't mistakes, you just feel they are because you have practiced it one way and then when expressing emotion you are feeling, it comes out another. Were they really mistakes in technique, or just another way of playing?
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Date May 4 2012 20:00:11
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turnermoran
Posts: 391
Joined: Feb. 6 2010
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RE: Practice and Musicality (in reply to Grisha)
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Grisha - when you say "..my slow numbers were close to the most musical I have ever played. But during practice I can't touch that. " are you suggesting that that problem is that *during practice* you aren't able to tap into the emotions, but they happen on stage?
Because I would think that is very normal for a player of your level; that practice becomes maintenance, and when you step on stage, the emotions and musicality etc all come back.
Also: a recent study just came out regarding the creative part of the brain. Someone wrote a book..they had a thing on NPR. Can't remember the book title or author - sorry.
Anyway, they gave college students enough alcohol to drink that they couldn't drive a car, yet they scored 30% higher on creative reasoning type tests then their sober counter parts. The book is really about the fact that we are at our most creative when we're not trying to be. It's just how the brain is wired. But in our culture, when we're trying to solve a problem, we drink coffee and chain ourselves to our desk and pull an all-nighter. But then the answer comes when we're spacing out in the shower the next day.
Maybe you're just trying too hard? 
Anyway, best of luck. I think we're all certain this is a minor blip on your journey. Fact is, you have a special special set of skills and abilities that makes you a very rare individual. What you are experiencing is certainly normal, but in the specific way that you are experiencing it is probably best relatable to others with your talents. Are you familiar with Julian Lage? Another prodigy. He spent a lot of time with Alexander Technique people. Says it helped him a lot. Might be cool to reach out to him. He's a very kind soul and I think you would have much in common to talk about. You can find him on FaceBook
Saludos
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Date May 4 2012 20:01:35
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kudo
Posts: 2064
Joined: Sep. 3 2009
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RE: Practice and Musicality (in reply to Grisha)
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Grisha, I have had the same experience before. I found 2 things that really helped:
1- taking a break and coming back to play what I really love to play,and play my very own stuff and compose my own stuff. it does not have to be technically complex, take something technically simple but very nice , such as the Diego del Gastor and the Moron style stuff, very nice with lots of aire.
the biggest pleasure and emotions I have ever had in flamenco, is when I feel the presence of the duende when practicing, and that only happened 5 or 6 times so far.the greatest feeling in the world
2- I say to myself in everything in life, not just flamenco, I will never please everyone,so I will do what I like to do, I do not care what people think. you have to remember that even if you play the hardest stuff from Paco, there will be someone in the audience who will just not like the piece or is bored from hearing this piece or something, so no matter what one does, one will never please everyone! luckily, I think NO BODY needs to do that, not even Paco! JUST DO WHAT YOU LOVE ! people will love it when you do it for yourself, when you enjoy and love what you are doing, and not just playing like a machine. who cares about the technicality ? does not need to be technically perfect.
and especially for you, you have to remember that people have deep respect and admiration to you Grisha, so relax and do what you love 
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Date May 5 2012 12:14:46
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XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
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RE: Practice and Musicality (in reply to Grisha)
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AFAIK, there is no way to find out whether someone playing a piece is being emotional at that point in time. Hence i dont care whether the player really has emotions or not. But everybody can relate to whether they feel something having an emotional effect on them. And yes, just like the question of what is flamenco, there seems to be a sort of agreement on certain players being more or less emotional. You cannot deny the empirical fact that too much technicality p*sses many people off in terms of perceiving a performance as emotional. But, unlike others, i dont see a reason to dislike that fact. It is upon everybody to accept differences in tastes. I mean if there would be a formula to measure emotionality of a piece, then this would be to write here. But since there is none, we have to live with the above statement. (Sorry i totally lost my point here... i felt i had an important conclusion to make, i had it already finished, but it slipped away somehow during writing.)
Ah, one interesting comparison. Take language for example. Some people speak as if they have no emotions. Type some letters in a computer program for "auto reading" and you will see, that it sounds very "inhuman". The software and algorithm gets better and actually the results nowadays are noticeably better. So maybe there is a formula to emotional playing to, just like there seems to be one for emotional language.
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Фламенко
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Date May 6 2012 9:51:56
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Florian
Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia
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RE: Practice and Musicality (in reply to Grisha)
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brilliant topic and comments..
its one of those things I think we all felt regardless of our levels but haven't really put it in words....i don't have any answers just a theory saying pretty much the same thing u saying..
its so true..
When one feels sharp with technique due to lots of practice or playing it becomes the focus...tries to impress, entertain (call it whatever you will) mostly through that aspect or if not completely it becomes a huge part of it....
When one dosent particularly feel in shape due to lack of time for practice...well all they have to hang on to is the musicality, the feel, the atmosphere etc..
I feel better playing when i have done a lot of playing and everything i try for works, and my fingers just find and do everything naturally and with no effort or fear... but i sound more musical when i don't feel as confident technically..or at least i think i do because i am not expecting much from myself...
There is no real proof that this isn't just something more to do with the way we feel ...rather than concrete facts....take our feelings out of the equation...for all we know we might sound exactly the same to a neutral ear.
When out of shape technically ...our expectation is way less of ourselfs (so anything is a bonus, u got nowhere to go but up) when in shape we have much greater expectations of ourselfs and perhaps its eazyer to feel unsatisfied..
and on the other side of the coin
who knows...maybe over technique in a piece could be a musicality killer..i don't know...the skill is to have it without it trying to influence too much the story telling
but that's impossible when you are playing something where the technique is half of the story or the attraction...like in your case Paco's fandangos or whatever.. i never looked at that piece expecting melodic gratification, technique showcasing is a huge part of it, imo...those picado runs are not there to say "look how humble i am about my technique, pay attention only to the melody and the story"
i for one never found you non musical, ...my attention might have been pulled away from the melody at times by your skill but again that was as much part of the script as the melody... in your case its impossible to separate the skill from the melody i think...
someone else mentioned this earlier, i also find you extremely musical when u are doing your stuff and experimenting with your musical ideas, cause i know for sure its you...
like that farucca u did for me years ago...still one of the most musical piece of music i have EVER heard...in fact i might upload it here, nothing fancy but so beautifully spaced and speaks volumes..but also dont get me wrong...i love it when u do the technical stuff too!!
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Date May 7 2012 7:41:52
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