RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale

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Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to gitanillotomillo)

Ok, sounds all good to me. Thats how the world works. That´s cool.

Well I know Reyes guitars are great..I would like to own one by myself.. But its not possible. Greatest sound. Conde and Reyes. There is no doubt.

But what do you think Vicente, Paco, Tomatito, Antonio Rey..etc. pay for these big name guitars? 1000€ maybe? Because they are the promoters. So.. there are 2 ways to get such a guitar. 1st learn to play and compose like the PROs. 2nd. be rich.

Well,..I´m out I guess.. :/

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 27 2012 19:39:50

Ruphus

Posts: 3782
Joined: Nov. 18 2010

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

Not that it could compensate for disproportionate conditions, but at least for a good part guitars boosted by collectors must belong to the special ones. Special in making, performance or at least in terms of historical artifact.

But when you sit in a store, evaluating an item from a batch of contemporary serial production, optically stunning with beautiful woods and finish, however playable and sounding on estudio level ...
With you thus expecting maybe 1500 or 2000 bucks, and finally pulling around the price label that´s dangling down from the headstock to find the price at EUR 18 000 ...

That´s when you ultimately lose track on the finesse of methodical nonesense.

Ruphus

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 27 2012 20:44:34

Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3430
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Doitsujin

Arash....that means that it could be a crap guitar. But only cos it is this maker..they pay 10.000€.

So why uploading videos and sound samples? Its all useless since nobody cares about the quality but only about the label inside of the guitar. So it´s not for playing basically.. it is more like an investment. Like into houses. From that viewpoint Im ok.

It could be a good investment and also a great guitar. This one and Antonio Rey's sound really good in the clips.

A friend got a '76 Reyes new. They were still reasonably priced back then. I liked my '67 Ramirez blanca better. I liked another friend's '73 Conde better. The Reyes owner liked the Reyes better. It was a really good guitar.

If the '76 Reyes had been mine I would have put a little higher saddle on it to reduce the buzz, but still leave some snap when I wanted it. The way it was set up, it sounded like a snare drum on rasgueados. Rey plays his with no buzz at all.

Así es la vida.

RNJ

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 27 2012 21:13:27

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

Now I remember one of my friends (an older guy around 60 maybe) owns an old Reyes. He brought it to a dance class where I used to play. I played it for the day. It was very old with peg heads..he got it for small money in far past directly from the maker. It was the greatest guitar I´ve ever played... It was inspirational just to play with that thing. And the Reyes from another firend.was solala..average. I would prefer my Carpios. Well,..I also own a carpio for over 4000Euros.. lol... so I should shut up with ridiculous pricing haha. Well but my guitars are all gold!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 27 2012 21:38:02

gitanillotomillo

Posts: 29
Joined: Jan. 6 2012
From: Holland

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

Hi there,

Of course Reyes is a legendary luthier. But we have to take a few things in consideration when we judge on the guitar sound of any guitar. First of all the player, then there's the guitar and of course the microphone and amps.
We, regular earthlings will never sound like Vicente Amigo or Antonio Rey although some people think they do. These guys practice 25 hours a day and they are inspired by their community, flamenco is just around the corner. As for most of us, we don't have such a background and we don't have flamenco fiestas around the corner. Youtube is our only resource to quality flamenco. So these guys have a head start, it's impossible to catch up with these guys.
Secondly there's guitar. Of course a good instrument helps, but let's not forget that it is the player that creates the magic on the guitar. I am pretty convinced that Vicente Amigo sounds pretty well on a Juan Salvador factory made guitar. Of course when the same Vincente playes a Reyes the difference is eminent.
And the last thing I want to point out is the microphone setup. I don't know anything about mikes and amps, that will be another fine thread. What I do know is that is makes quite a difference. Check these two videos of Antonio Rey. In the first one his sound is pimped up by a nice microphone and a nice amp. In the second clip there are no effects added whatsoever. It was probably recorded with a cellphone. It's the same guitar, but what a diffrence!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 28 2012 6:52:19

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

Yeah agree there completely!

And check this on, too.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 28 2012 17:56:59

gitanillotomillo

Posts: 29
Joined: Jan. 6 2012
From: Holland

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

Hi Doijtsujin,

Thank for your posts. I know this clip. I was pretty amazed when I first heard this clip. I think this is one of the most beautiful Tarantas ever composed.
As for the sound, no guitar sounds like that without a very expensive microphone, a very expensive amp, a very expensive pre-amp and probably some other kind of effect processor on the side. Probably some digital mastering was done after the clip was recorded to make it sound even more dramatic.
I just wanna say to all the guys out there who think a Reyes will make them sound like this: IT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN! You're not even halfway there. Don't be fooled by all those 'special effects' added to these recordings. If you really want to know how you sound on any guitar just play it.
If you want to get a realistic idea of the full potential of any guitar, try to find a recording of a great artist playing such a guitar really unplugged. Check these clips.

The first one of Vicente playing his '88 Reyes. Even unplugged pretty decent I think.

The second one of Paco trying out an Erez Perelman. Paco is pretty impressed by the sound. He just can't stop playing. So if anyone wants to know what a Perelman sounds like, this is as good as it gets.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 28 2012 19:29:19

gitanillotomillo

Posts: 29
Joined: Jan. 6 2012
From: Holland

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to gitanillotomillo)

SOLD!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 12 2012 8:01:23

Michael1917

Posts: 146
Joined: Jan. 5 2007

RE: '78 Manuel Reyes (senior) for sale (in reply to Doitsujin)

The market sets the price, whether we may like it or not. And there are often thousands, if not millions of factors involved in why the market sets the price of the guitar to what it is. And, also, good players can take very inexpensive guitars and play them so well that it's often difficult to tell the difference between someone playing a $1000 guitar vs. a $20,000 guitar. (Robert Johnson, while not a flamenco player -- a blues player -- played a guitar sold by Sears & Roebuck.)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 13 2012 1:08:21