Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.
This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.
We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.
|
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated
|
You are logged in as Guest
|
Users viewing this topic: none
|
|
Login | |
|
mark indigo
Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated (in reply to coreydefresno)
|
|
|
quote:
Have you read Manolo's book? I am getting tired of this. Do you need the english version? Do you not speak, and read, in Spanish? in case you hadn't noticed, this is an English language forum. Some people here are fluent in Spanish, some people have no Spanish, I guess most of us (myself included) are somewhere in between (and i'm sure many, self included, are engaged in ongoing learning of spanish as well as guitar). It's not only "uncivil" to harangue members of an English language forum for not being fluent in Spanish, it's a bit pointless.... If you make any kind of statement on this forum, you are putting it up for discussion, for people to agree, disagree, question, etc. If you defend your statements by telling us all to go read a book (regardless of the language it's written in) that's pretty lame, why not explain what you are talking about yourself? And post examples? Alternately, why not post up the relevant sections of the book for us all to see, with translation for the benefit of those of us less than fluent? Or even just post up the relevant section/s and maybe someone else will translate (there's at least one pro translater hereabouts!). None of this is a personal attack on you, and I mean absolutely no disrespect to Manolo, you don't need to tell any of us what a maestro he is, I'm sure most people here count Tauromagia as one of the top flamenco guitar albums (well, I do anyway), and I waited years for Mundo Y Formas to be re-released on cd as I knew it existed for years but couldn't get hold of it. Also, although I've never been on his courses myself, I know people who have, and a good friend of mine who I play dance classes with every week was on one of his very early courses alongside Vicente. I'm fascinated by Manolo's ideas, I just don't know what they are yet....
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 23 2010 16:11:23
|
|
JasonMcGuire
Posts: 1141
Joined: Apr. 10 2007
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated (in reply to coreydefresno)
|
|
|
quote:
Ah yes, the roof of the Hotel Hespedes, in Cordoba, one of my favorite hangs. I am proud that Fresno State has such a treasure! CW That was actually in Florida. quote:
I am tired of this, it is obvious that no matter how completely I answer you, you still say these things? Why? Because it IS acceptable to move from an E7 to an A minor in Cante Jondo in my opinion. quote:
If I were to spend my days answering to BS like this, I would never practice. So what I am saying is B-ullS-hit? I don't practice very much anymore. If you have to practice 16 hours a day to play the way you do, I might suggest to you a better approach to practicing. If you insist on referring to what I post as BS then shouldn't I have the right to talk about your playing? Up until now I haven't really criticized your playing. I did make a satirical cartoon where a superhero wearing a toilet hat and a roll of toilet paper on his unitard as an emblem confronts a colleague about a fictitious series of events including "making it" with a flamenco dancer on Juan Serrano's desk and not cleaning up afterwards. I have mentioned it before here that I am a fan of comedians Bill Hicks, George Carlin and Andy Kaufman. Sorry if you are still upset about that, but I did apologize. This doesn't change the fact that I still feel strongly about the possibility of changing from E7, E7(b9), E7sus4(b9), E7(b5), E7(#5,b9) or any other voicing of the E altered dominant chord to an A minor chord if I wish to do so as an artist. I don't myself look to anyone else for approval of my compositions or improvisations. I have been asked by many to explain how I approach harmony and I am pretty open about it and try to share with those who are interested. You qre speaking for another person and I am pretty sure as often is the case that things get lost in translation. quote:
Do you need the english version? Do you not speak, and read, in Spanish? It is widely known that I don't speak/read Spanish very well. No headline there.
_____________________________
http://www.Flamenco-Lessons.com/ http://www.CaminosFlamencos.com/ http://www.youtube.com/user/Bikhiyal http://flamenco-lessons.blogspot.com
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 23 2010 19:42:30
|
|
XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated (in reply to coreydefresno)
|
|
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: coreydefresno quote:
2) The question whether it is following the cante or not is irrelevant, because you could take a singer, change the key to Am and make a cante/guitar performance with a solea in Am. With respect to the author of this quote: This is the most grave mistake anyone could make in flamenco. I will bet you my last dollar I know exactly what my teacher would say, Solea in Am? "Eso es flamenco de mierda del culo!" Corey, through all your posts, i dont know what it is, if its lack of security or too much faith in authorities... first a discussion is more than just the exchange of quotes or opinions of authorities. Furthermore, gaining wisdom, experience does not work with such a limited attitude. A teacher who does not learn or is not willing to learn, is a bad teacher. Or am i wrong? I dont know i just think the only limit that art has is TASTE and not some "do not go to this chord" way of thinking. I consider this to be very vulgar and to be honest, dumb.
_____________________________
Фламенко
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 23 2010 20:13:59
|
|
JasonMcGuire
Posts: 1141
Joined: Apr. 10 2007
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated (in reply to henrym3483)
|
|
|
quote:
most of the common progs i've seen for tarantas form tend to lead from F#-Bm-A7-G7 resolving on the F# chord. Any other transitions that are possible? B7(b9), Emin7, G/F, F#7sus4(b9) D7,G,E7,A, D7,G,G7(#11),F#7sus4(b9) C7(#11), Bmin, C7(#11), Bmin, E7, A, G7(#11), F#7sus4(b9) Bb7(#11), A, G7(#11),F#sus4(b9) A7, D, G7(#11),F#sus4(b9) Bmin9,Bb7(#9),Amin9,Ab7(#9),G7(#11),F#sus4(b9)
_____________________________
http://www.Flamenco-Lessons.com/ http://www.CaminosFlamencos.com/ http://www.youtube.com/user/Bikhiyal http://flamenco-lessons.blogspot.com
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 23 2010 20:37:06
|
|
henrym3483
Posts: 1584
Joined: Nov. 13 2005
From: Limerick,Ireland
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated (in reply to JasonMcGuire)
|
|
|
quote:
B7(b9), Emin7, G/F, F#7sus4(b9) D7,G,E7,A, D7,G,G7(#11),F#7sus4(b9) C7(#11), Bmin, C7(#11), Bmin, E7, A, G7(#11), F#7sus4(b9) Bb7(#11), A, G7(#11),F#sus4(b9) A7, D, G7(#11),F#sus4(b9) Bmin9,Bb7(#9),Amin9,Ab7(#9),G7(#11),F#sus4(b9) nice noodling with this will keep me happy for ages. thanks jason.
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 23 2010 21:36:45
|
|
KMMI77
Posts: 1821
Joined: Jul. 26 2009
From: The land down under
|
RE: Music theory is way too complicated (in reply to Guest)
|
|
|
quote:
quote: When accompanying solea i often hear guitarists play the above chord with a rasqueado strongly marking 1,2 3, then silent on the 4,5,6 then sev, en 8 marked as down strokes then E7 on nine and Am on 10. I've posted this several times. Manolo is really talking about using that at ends of phrases. See this: http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=152670&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=&tmode=&smode=&s=#152955 In the last post I list relative keys. C major - A minor - and E phrygian are relatives. Not much separates A minor from E phrygian. Moving to A minor in itself is not "fatal" or "letal." But if you move to it at ends of phrases (Cadences), it changes the system from phrygian to minor. That seems to be what Manolo is against (at least in his book). That is why I say Phrygian in flamenco is TONAL WITH SOME MODAL TENDENCIES. In E phrygian, you can borrow alot from A minor. Those final cadences HAVE to stay in phrygian though...or the system changes. So when you go from E7 to A minor in the first line of cante...IT IS OK because the final line will always take you back to E. In solo guitar, the guitarist either 1) MUST return to E phrygian, or 2) take artistic license and potentially lose a concurso. SEE ABOVE Thanks Romerito, Sorry to frustrate you, I look forward to your video in the other thread.
_____________________________
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 24 2010 3:24:19
|
|
New Messages |
No New Messages |
Hot Topic w/ New Messages |
Hot Topic w/o New Messages |
Locked w/ New Messages |
Locked w/o New Messages |
|
Post New Thread
Reply to Message
Post New Poll
Submit Vote
Delete My Own Post
Delete My Own Thread
Rate Posts
|
|
|
Forum Software powered by ASP Playground Advanced Edition 2.0.5
Copyright © 2000 - 2003 ASPPlayground.NET |
0.09375 secs.
|