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good call been on an exploration of this myself of late...a mission to get a reasonable alzapua together last tip was to support im with arched fingers either on 1st string or soundboard a is relaxed with q angled out [like tomatito]..l thumb in fairly vertical approx 120 deg to string...using nail... guess this involves moving the thumb mainly like a plectrum the previous tip given where it was suggested to move the wrist with no or little support of the fingers so would like to hear more about this...
this is something im spending a lot of time trying to get comfortable with also. i have been given the advice to use the wrist, and to rest i on the E string but more as a marker, not really as support
thats how i understand the advice i got anyway, and i feel like im making more progress this way, than when my thumb was moving a lot
as most of you know, im a beginner and in the very early stages of developing this technique though
my bad marker is a better word...semantics again...
i only pointed that out because i spent a bit of time really pushing against the string with i, and creating tension in my hand, and it encouraged me to use my thumb and not my wrist. i think it was a bad habit that i picked up from trying to copy video's and not asking the right questions
Not sure where I picked it up, but what helped me gain a lot of speed was the idea that you shouldn't look at it as three separate movements, but just as two, where after playing the single string with the thumb on the upwards movement, instead of consciously applying force for the next movement, you just apply enough pressure for the thumb to eventually "fall" down on the rest of the strings. Does that make any sense?
i am practicing arching my i finger (the one that is resting on the E string) i think it has always been straight in the past. this feels like its helping a bit
thanks Al
does anyone else have comments on using just the i finger or both i and m to rest on the string? and about having arched or curved finger when you do it?
Why is there not much of this man on you tube? Played with a guitarist last weekend who spent 3 months with carlos heredia...
not sure it's possible to learn this technique solely with video ...
quote:
Not sure where I picked it up, but what helped me gain a lot of speed was the idea that you shouldn't look at it as three separate movements, but just as two, where after playing the single string with the thumb on the upwards movement, instead of consciously applying force for the next movement, you just apply enough pressure for the thumb to eventually "fall" down on the rest of the strings. Does that make any sense?
makes sense my friend mentioned a point of relaxation in the movement.. working with this idea
i have been given the advice to use the wrist, and to rest i on the E string but more as a marker, not really as support
I have never felt comfortable planting while playing alzapua. I like to have my hand floating, which I find allows me to use my wrist a lot more. I feel it all in wrist personally, but there is some flicking in the thumb too I guess.
One thing that has helped me a lot is to really angle my thumb and have it perpendicular to the strings. It makes the angle of attack a lot easier and offers better positioning for changing strings. Not sure if this is the right way to do it, but works for me.
Carlos is very superstitious. He sometimes sabotages things that could lead to success. For example when I was recording with him in New York back in 1994 he would only ride in my car not the limousine provided by the record company. He also refused to stay in the hotel room because it was too high. I had to request for him a room on the 1st or 2nd floor. I had to use my dark gifts to persuade the girl to do that for him. He didn't trust ANYONE in New York except for me it seemed. I think it had something to do with compas. He never signed the record contract the company gave him, so they didn't have any way of paying him for the CD we made. It actually sold pretty well and it was just 2 years ago that they asked me to try and get in touch with him so they could pay him. I arranged a bank transfer so he could finally get paid.
Carlos really is a great player and a good guy despite his quirkiness. He is a great teacher. He is building guitars now. Over the years we have stayed in touch mainly when he needed to get some more acryllic nail stuff. I had to repair his thumb nail to get us through the recording and he realized the value of being able to repair broken nails. He also got a hold of me after Distancias was first released to congratulate me and to say that he enjoyed the aggressiveness of my playing.
Carlos was once a very in demand player and it was common to see him sitting next to Requeni playing for Antonio Canales and Carlos was for a time Juana Amaya's guitarist of choice before Paco Fernandez took that position. He made a really great Album with Carlos Benavent and Jorge Pardo that was NEVER released. He played it for me in New York and I was amazed that the record company didn't want to release that instead of what we were recording but Chesky records was into using 1 mic hung above us in a church..... audiophile's... jeesh. He was for a long time the house guitarist at "La Carboneria" and he could be found there reliably to setup lessons.
There was a video of him teaching some really cool stuff on YouTube that was posted a while back.
Anyway..... I love Carlos. It was because of his approval of me that people in New York started to call me for work. After Carlos spoke highly of me to all the flamencos at a party La Conja called me to play in her show and that is how I finally got together with Pedro who I had been trying to get lessons without success.
Pedro Cortes' father RIP told me "pretend you are rowing a boat and the thumb is your oar."
Think of that and watch the video of Carlos Heredia and see if that makes any sense.
I'm not sure if it was to the tortilla de patata or clever analogies like this, but when I left Florida after staying with the Cortes family, alzapua was no longer an issue for me.
I met Carlos Heredia 4 weeks ago in the Carboneria, Sevilla. Had a very nice evening! He still makes guitars and give lessons. The guy plays very good, and is very amable. If any body is interested for lessons, or his guitars.. C/.2 Ronda de Ntra. Sra. de la Oliva Blg. 175-Bajo B Telefone 622 45 40 04 41013-Sevilla.
I am sure Carlos would apreciate some adverticement.
made a picture with a local singer, the nice things happen in the Carboneria always after or before the regular performances...:-) The japanese guy second at his left played very good too, very modern stuff, sorry, I forgot his name...
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I had to use my dark gifts to persuade the girl to do that for him.
i always thought you were some kind of sith lord does using the force help to get a nice strong alzapua?
on a more serious note
quote:
I like to have my hand floating, which I find allows me to use my wrist a lot more
this feels comfortable if i do it, but i find it takes a lot more control to minimise the movements. i tend to move the wrist too far.
what are peoples thoughts on "economy" while playing alzapua. what i mean is, making the movements as short as possible (not going far past the strings) this seems to be a very important part of most technique (especially ones that are done very fast) i think its a good point to discuss
since yesterday when i started bending my i finger, i noticed that more of my thumb is hitting the strings, i think this is really helping me
There was a video of him teaching some really cool stuff on YouTube that was posted a while back.
I was the one who posted that video but i decided to remove it. I didn't feel right about posting a video of someone without their permission. He is a great player though! He was always at la carboneria when i was in seville, getting the party started.
Watch other guitarists doing alzapúa (in videos if there's nobody in your area), preferrably guitarists with hands and fingers similar to your own. Also, obviously, keep practicing it and experimenting. It takes a while to develop a feel for it and to find what works best for you (stability, reliability, etc.)
There are at least two ways to do alzapúa (real alzapúa, not the ancient thumb-and-index technique that sometimes sounds very similar). One way is to keep your index (I use middle) anchored on the first string or the soundboard. This way involves very little or no wrist rotation. The other way is to use lots of wrist rotation and no anchoring. This way is kind of sloppy, it's easier to get the hang of, and it's used by very few of today's accomplished players. However, IMO, if you can keep it under control, it's louder and fuller than the first way, although that doesn't mean that it's better all the time. I tend to use the second way when it fits what the left hand is doing (no unwanted notes) and I want a lot of strings to ring loudly. In the unanchored way, there's a bit of movement of the thumb itself from the knuckle where it joins your hand, but most of the movement comes from the rotation of the two bones in your forearm. They're joined at the elbow, and one sort of pivots around the other (like turning a key in a lock). The important thing here is NOT to use the kind of forearm movement that comes from the elbow. In other words, don't change the angle formed by your forearm and upper arm.
When anchoring, on the downstroke that falls just before the upstroke, you should be using a kind of rest stroke, although this term is usually used for upward finger movements like picado and arpeggios, and in this case we're talking about a downward thumbstroke. For example, if you're playing por medio...
...you want to rest your thumb on a higher-pitched string (the high E) on the first and fourth of the five strokes seen above. Sometimes you can even get the high string lodged between your thumbnail and the flesh, although that's kind of extreme. In the example above, the rest stroke could be on the second string, although it would remove that voice from the "chord."
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does using the force help to get a nice strong alzapua? 
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