distinction between T & R

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>General >>

Page: [1]

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

CarloJuan

Posts: 169
Joined: Sep. 19 2010
From: Philippines

distinction between T & R

What is the evident difference between a tango and a rumba?

Forgive me for the newbie question, but a little of your spare time could answer this question quickly.

I'm confused because both have the same 4/4 rhythm, and even the palmas sound the same. Is it the progression of the chords that make it a tango or a rumba? Sometimes the rumba is even slightly faster or more upbeat than the tango. But that doesn't really mean i favor the one over the other. I actually like tangos very much.

Here's a link in youtube played by Vicente Amigo it's called Tres notas para decir te quiero some people say it's a rumba but i tend, IMO to feel it more of as a tango.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2010 9:48:34

James Ashley Mayer

Posts: 115
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Portland, Oregon

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

I've been confused by the difference, at times. Most of the time, it's pretty apparent. But I can think of two excellent songs from the Vengo soundtrack (La Caita and Remedios Silva Pisa (I think I have these names right)). Those tracks sound like both tangos and rumba, to me.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2010 18:19:03

veet

Posts: 231
Joined: Nov. 29 2004
From: L.A.

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

lots of subtle distinctions between the two, and you'll hear a lot of arguments about it.

A couple of things that I've heard, that make sense to me: David el Gamba of Jerez, in a palmas class, said that Tangos uses the foot, ie a stomp on the 1, and rumba doesn't. Rumba, he says, is volando, flying freely. I'd definitely characterize the Vicente piece as volando

Also, a cajon player friend, Patric Oliver of POP percussion, says that tangos emphasizes the 2, in both palmas and cajon, and rumba either drops it entirely or softens it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2010 18:25:03

yohan

Posts: 306
Joined: Feb. 5 2007

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

-tango is (usually) not played in minor key
-tango is (usually) slower played then a rumba
-rumba has different accents and more syncopated feeling.
-tango has (usually) the first beat silenced, rumba starts on beat 1.
-...more?

though imo vicente's tres nota's has definitely a rumba feeling not tangos.

_____________________________

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2010 18:35:34

Pimientito

Posts: 2481
Joined: Jul. 30 2007
From: Marbella

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

Hope this helps

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Follow my blog http://pimientito.wordpress.com/

"Ceremonial" by Mark Shurey "Pimientito". CD and digital download vailable on Amazon and
CDbaby. http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/markshurey

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2010 18:48:52

at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 28 2010 21:16:02

Ricardo

Posts: 14806
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

basic rhythmic difference is the rhythmic accents. Tangos accents in 4 count are on 2 and 4....the up beats. Rumba it is important that the accent happens on the & between 2 and 3, but 4 is accented the same. Also, it is ok to have the down beat accented in rumba more so then in Tangos. Truth is the two feels can inter mix somewhat, I say flamencos do many rumbas with more of a tangos feel then vice versa. But it depends.

Here is a good example of a fast tangos that retains the tango feel instead of going all "rumba" just because it is fast:

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 29 2010 1:39:19

por medio

Posts: 289
Joined: Nov. 15 2009

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

It's the compas that differentiates the two. Note that compas is more than how many beats there are in a bar; it's the "intention" and aire of the music.

I don't have much time at the moment to give you some youtube examples - I'll see if I can find some over the days and post it.

But there definitely are pieces/songs that sit dead between the tangos and rumba. I think Vicente's piece above is one of them so don't pull your hair out trying to define it (I used to, until my teacher - whom I miss terribly since now I live a long way from him - said "It's just music! It's just flamenco!).

Vicente has often mentioned that he likes to create music that is just "music" and does not belong to a palo. You can certainly see that in many of his pieces.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 29 2010 1:40:26

Chiste de Gales

Posts: 298
Joined: Jan. 13 2009

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

Heres a basic example of a Rumba:

And a basic example of Tangos:

Just compare the first 12 seconds of both and you'll hear the difference quite clearly.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 29 2010 2:42:45

felipe

Posts: 39
Joined: Jul. 1 2010
From: Poland

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to CarloJuan)

Rumba has also usually a bit more song form (letra-estribillo-letra-estrbillo), tango's structure is more flamenco, a combination of letras, falsetas, remates. This can mix anyway. Try to listen to the singing (the melody and structure).

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Sep. 30 2010 13:15:32

CarloJuan

Posts: 169
Joined: Sep. 19 2010
From: Philippines

RE: distinction between T & R (in reply to felipe)

quote:

ORIGINAL: felipe

Rumba has also usually a bit more song form (letra-estribillo-letra-estrbillo), tango's structure is more flamenco, a combination of letras, falsetas, remates. This can mix anyway. Try to listen to the singing (the melody and structure).

cool thanks felipe

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 1 2010 4:54:40