RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread

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Pimientito

Posts: 2481
Joined: Jul. 30 2007
From: Marbella

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

Oooppps....I have been rumbled. I should mention that this is compared to the high quantity of testosterone on the advanced thread as the various professionals treat the challenge like pistols at dawn.

Is it too late to swap places with one of you guys?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 16 2009 9:18:23

El Camino

Posts: 59
Joined: Jan. 14 2008

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

Ive got to say im struggling with it .

I cant seem to match the tab with what im hearing , also the basic Bulerias i was working on has ingrained its self on my brain which means it keeps morphing into this one .

Ill keep pluging away though

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 16 2009 10:44:11

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to El Camino)

quote:

Ive got to say im struggling with it .

I cant seem to match the tab with what im hearing , also the basic Bulerias i was working on has ingrained its self on my brain which means it keeps morphing into this one .

slow it down ...do it bar by bar...you still have enough time

look at the detail of the strumming and fingers used etc.. super super slow

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 16 2009 10:53:26

andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ailsa
It's funny I think this should not be too difficult because I've been playing for over a year and a half, and it's all pretty standard stuff.

Do you also dance Ailsa? That might give you an advantage (of feeling the bulerias rhythm) over those of us

who are raw beginners

I still look like Julian Bream trying to do rasgueados when I try to get through this

thanks to Ricardo for the video

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 16 2009 14:31:37

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to andresito)

Yeah I do dance and maybe that means I'm familiar with the compas. But that's all in my head - my fingers are damned disobedient!

By the way who's the badass looking guy with the fringe in your avatar?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 16 2009 14:35:05

andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ailsa
who's the badass looking guy with the fringe in your avatar?

LOL that's Javier Bardem in 'Perdita Durango'

he's a funny guy

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 16 2009 16:59:18

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to andresito)

OK where is everybody? Why is nobody posting?? I bet you are all off practising for the challenge aren't you?!!!

I've just stopped for tonight. I decided to just play the compas I find most tricky over and again. When I did that I could play it, but when I put it back into the whole piece it was worse than ever!

Fingers all over the place.

OK I'm giving up for tonight....

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 17 2009 14:51:12

sam_m

Posts: 71
Joined: Nov. 24 2008
From: St.Helens, England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

Chill - some rest time is good.

You often find you'll go away and when you come back it's a whole lot easier.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 17 2009 15:39:32

andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ailsa
OK where is everybody? Why is nobody posting?? I bet you are all off practising for the challenge aren't you?!!!

LOL yes

This actually has been quite a challenge, as intended by Flo. Learning to play your first Bulerias is quite different to learning one when you can play some already, and the learning curve is daunting at first. I've had to reassess my technique as well since I was getting too tense with all this pressure!
Interestingly, Gerhard Graf-Martinez doesn't even get up to Bulerias in his Flamenco Guitar Method Vol 1. Juan Martin does, late in his Arte de la Guitarra Flamenca Vol 1 but asks and answers why such a complex 'virtuoso' toque is approached so early in the study of flamenco forms.
Someone said in the advanced thread (I think) that this challenge will be a struggle for beginners, but that they will learn a lot!
Meanwhile the thread is up to 7 pages for the Doitsujin Open... er, 'Advanced Challenge'

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 17 2009 16:49:25

sam_m

Posts: 71
Joined: Nov. 24 2008
From: St.Helens, England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

That would be my only niggle with the GM books is that I wish the compas was brought in a little earlier - it's touched upon in the first volume, and I still find some of those exercises tricky, but there's not much detail.

Luckily, I have the second book as well, so I'll be going through some of the stuff in there that relates to the challenge.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 18 2009 10:03:30

andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to sam_m)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sam_m
Luckily, I have the second book as well, so I'll be going through some of the stuff in there that relates to the challenge.

you cad

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 18 2009 14:40:01

sam_m

Posts: 71
Joined: Nov. 24 2008
From: St.Helens, England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

Aha! And you, sir, are a cad and a boundah!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 18 2009 15:23:44

andresito

Posts: 377
Joined: Feb. 20 2007
From: New Holland

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to sam_m)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sam_m
That would be my only niggle with the GM books is that I wish the compas was brought in a little earlier

Yes, that, and the fact the bloody thing's not spiral-bound

Makes it VERY hard to keep it open to the page you're trying to play

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 18 2009 23:45:53

sam_m

Posts: 71
Joined: Nov. 24 2008
From: St.Helens, England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

See, all the anger's coming out !

Not all holding hands now, are we !?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 1:50:59

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to sam_m)

quote:

all the anger's coming out ! Not all holding hands now, are we !?

Yeah but Sam we are united in our anger at the lack of spiral binding! We are as one in our protests!!

So how you guys getting on? We've only got just over a week, and I'm still struggling with the fluff-monster at the bottom of page 2! I haven't checked that my microphone works yet either!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 3:34:57

domzo

Posts: 64
Joined: Jan. 10 2007

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

Hi Ailsa, Well I've been slacking and don't know it very well yet... didn't realise how little time we had... (or maybe I'm bluffing?!

)

Anyway, I found Grisha's tips on scale practice useful for practicing the run at the end of page 2.

i.e. play one note, then 2, then 3 - breaking it down like this really helps get the timing of the pulloffs/hammer ons right.

Then when you can do the run, practice going straight into the run from the bar before, and when you can do that practice going out of the run at the other end into the next bar.

Any more tips just ask

Cheers Dom

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 4:04:40

El_flaco

Posts: 44
Joined: Jan. 28 2009
From: Pacifica, CA-US

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa) 1 votes

Ailsa,

I've been busy digging ditches

Literally.

Spiral binding is so nice. All music books should have them.

Regarding the 'Fluff monster', I took my time on that one. I don't know if it helps, but I use all P on that one and the last 5 notes I use a chord shape. (don't know what chord that one is. I can figure it out, but too lazy right now. )

Pimientito,
Well I couldn't find a picture of us dancing/holding hands/singing, etc., but I think this is as close as I can get.

Is the advanced challenge more like this??

Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 4:57:25

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to El_flaco)

quote:

the last 5 notes I use a chord shape. (don't know what chord that one is.

Yeah, me too - I think it's an A chord with a flat9. It's getting into that shape cleanly that's my problem!

Nice animations by the way - the advanced challenge one is hilarious. I particularly like the variety with which the white-headed guy defeats his opponent

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 5:13:24

El_flaco

Posts: 44
Joined: Jan. 28 2009
From: Pacifica, CA-US

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

quote:

It's getting into that shape cleanly that's my problem!

I had problems with it too. I started practicing it at 40 bpm until it felt comfortable and then brought it up to 60 and tied it in with the rest. It helped a lot, it definitely feels more comfortable now.

yeah, when I found that animation, I just couldn't resist.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 5:24:23

domzo

Posts: 64
Joined: Jan. 10 2007

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to El_flaco) 1 votes

quote:

It's getting into that shape cleanly that's my problem!

I'm surprised you find the chord hard (knowing your playing) - you're not barring it are you? I know you love barre chords

Try just placing the first 3 fingers and leave the little finger off till you actually need to sound the first string (put it on at the last minute).

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 6:10:56

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to domzo)

quote:

I know you love barre chords

barre

that is a dirty word! Go wash your mouth out!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 6:33:05

El Camino

Posts: 59
Joined: Jan. 14 2008

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

Ive taken Florians advice and slowed it right down and its working but this challenge has made me realise how bad my resgueo is my ami ras is ok but my eami ras is really bad .

Lots more work for me to do , this really is a challenge .

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 7:26:38

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa) 1 votes

quote:

barre

that is a dirty word! Go wash your mouth out!!

Ailsa,

Sometimes the perception of it can make it actually seem harder.

Simplify it.

Think of a full barre as using your index finger as a capo and the other three fingers as just really holding a basic chord shape.

cheers,

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 10:02:29

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ron.M)

Yeah I think that's a good tip, and that is how I think of it since spending a week with Jingle in Nerja last April. Trouble is I just don't have the strength, or the right angle on my index, or something, to hold all the strings cleanly.

If I just put the barre itself down it's fine. When I try to introduce some other fingers, say the a finger two frets up on 5th, the 2nd and 3rd strings start twanging!

By the way I just had my first try at recording the challenge. It was atrocious!!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 10:25:07

at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa) 1 votes

if you feel like you dont have enough strength, try using the weight of your arm. pull/drop your arm back slightly and let the fingers sink into the fingerboard.

when i figured this out i was so happy.

try it out!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 19 2009 11:53:03

takitaka

Posts: 55
Joined: Apr. 13 2008

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Ailsa)

Hi, Ailsa if you are finding bar 8 tricky it may be that you are playing the 3rd note as an F which is wrong, it should be G# at the 4th fret

Hope the helps

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 20 2009 5:49:17

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to takitaka)

Thanks to everyone who made suggestions to help

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 20 2009 6:29:54

domzo

Posts: 64
Joined: Jan. 10 2007

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to Pimientito)

quote:

Hi, Ailsa if you are finding bar 8 tricky it may be that you are playing the 3rd note as an F which is wrong, it should be G# at the 4th fret Hope the helps

I can't connect this statement with the tab at all. By bar 8 I assume you mean the bit at the end of page 2? But anyay the 3rd note is A# isn't it?

Anyway, the challenge is surely as laid out in the tab, not in some additional literature that some people are apparently using to better their chances

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 20 2009 7:55:50

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: Challenge, Beginners Thread (in reply to domzo)

ooohhhh Dom you're tough!!

Actually I couldn't figure out where the F in bar 8 is either, but takitaka was trying to help, contributing to our sense of co-operation and wellbeing here on the beginner's thread, that's the main thing.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 20 2009 8:09:23